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Messages - jec9000

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Episode 3x22 / Re: You Know Where
« on: June 11, 2007, 09:32:32 AM »
I respect your points and I too saw the episode and heard her, but heck, she could have heard the story from him a hundred times by now and she is being sarcastic. That is what I mean by she is pitying him. 

I'm not trying to discredit anyone's theories here, but just trying to look at the final scene with a different perspective.

And I forgot, there is only one timeline.
That whole Desmond thing was just something to throw us off. How stupid of me! Better get me back to the "right thinkers".  :)

Have a great summer y'all.

Episode 3x22 / Re: You Know Where
« on: June 10, 2007, 09:42:22 PM »
wacky thought but what if the Kate in this timeline never went to the island and when Jack got off the island (as yet to be seen how) he is the only one with any memory of it, kind of like Desmond in Flashes Before Your Eyes.  The Kate in this timeline either doesn't remember being there or because the events of the timeline were altered, Kate was never there in the first place.
That may explain why she isn't a fugitive in this timeline, and why she seems to pity Jack rather than believe him. He has been pestering her and maybe other "Losties" with what they perceive to be insane ramblings about an island etc. And that is why Jack is in the state he is in.  Maybe she is the only former Lostie who has given him any hope of believing in him and that is why he keeps calling her and why the mysterious "he" she refers to musn't know she is meeting him. And Christian may indeed be alive in this timeline.   :)
Have to give this one some more thought but it is an interesting possiblility to while away the next months waiting.......

Episode 3x22 / Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« on: June 04, 2007, 07:48:06 PM »
So Naomi swoops in on the island from her unseen parachute where she jumped from an unseen helicopter which took off from a freighter 80 miles away - all sounds pretty suspect to begin with right? (Yes, I know they get a hold of 'Minkowski' on her satelite phone but he could be anywhere, true?)
But then she tosses in this information that their plane was found, bodies inside, in an ocean trench - memorials were held, new albums were released, blah blah blah.
Why do they believe her?

The official podcast tells us that either she was lying or there is a conspiracy and I for one think it may be both. There was a conspiracy to cover up the planes disappearance and obviously Naomi's story was a cover. So... how much did she really know? Was she really coming for Desmond? ...I doubt it.

We have to ask ourselves, what was her mission objective? I would guess it was simply to locate the island and then let the cavalry know. She even made sure someone else knew how to operate the phone in case something happened to her. So now we ask, who's cavalry? Is it the return of Dharma trying to reclaim the island or some other group?

I tend to agree with your thinking, but what I keep coming back to.....

If her mission objective was simply to locate the island and then radio its position back to her superiors, why even bother to make up such a complicated story about 815?  And why even bring up Desmond and Penny? As far as the losties know she IS looking for them and they would swallow that story hook, line and sinker with few questions. Why bother to tell them otherwise with some convoluted and strange story about the plane being found with all passengers dead? Wouldn't that just invite suspicion about her motives just from the sheer weirdness of it?

And if the Others found her first, why have any type of identifying objects with her at all, ie the picture of Desmond and its inherent Widmore connection.   I agree she may not be who she says she is, but if she wants to complete her mission objective with the least amount of scepticism from whomever finds her, why even bring the Des/Penny picture or mention the story about the 815 wreckage being found?  It just invites questions about her arrival.

I admit I know nothing about "special ops" protocol, but it seems to me that a simple story is best, not one with so many details.

Episode 3x22 / Re: Who Was Naomi?
« on: May 24, 2007, 10:05:21 PM »
Well, Naomi apparenty lied about being sent by Penny but why go to such elaborate lengths? Why not just say she is  part of a search crew looking for Flight 815? That would be enough to convince any losties that they are about to be rescued and they would help her. Why try to appeal to Desmond through Penny? Why say that the flight was found with all dead? She could get to the same place, ie having the losties trust her, just by saying she is part of a search crew for them.  Even if she is Dharma or some other evil conglomerate yet to be named, if she was concerned that the "Others" would find her first, why take the chance that they see her "fake" credentials ie the pic of Penny and Des and her story of being sent by Penny? What is the point? Am I missing something?

In summary, I am pondering why she had to orchestrate the Penny Widmore (including the picture) bit if she was just trying to gain the trust of whomever found her on the Island, Others or Losties.

Episode 3x22 / Re: Who was in the coffin?
« on: May 24, 2007, 08:31:15 PM »
It was Michael in the coffin.  

My reasons? When I saw the funeral director my first thought was it could be Michael.  Then when Kate acted so incredulous about going to the funeral/viewing, I figured it had to be somebody really loathsome, so putting two and two together I surmised it was Michael.  With all the unanswered questions out there about where everybody is in the "now", why couldn't it be Michael?

Episode 3x21 / Re: Where Does Locke Fit In?
« on: May 23, 2007, 08:43:22 PM »
For now it seems so....give 'em time!

Episode 3x21 / Re: Where Does Locke Fit In?
« on: May 23, 2007, 08:19:45 PM »
Good point about imparting to the inhabitants the impossiblility of leaving.  The duality thing again, Ben is trying to keep alive the hope that there is a way off the island, Locke is trying to do the opposite.

Episode 3x21 / Re: Is Naomi A Liar Poll
« on: May 23, 2007, 08:12:47 PM »
I think she is telling the truth.  We'll see.......

Episode 3x21 / Re: Where Does Locke Fit In?
« on: May 23, 2007, 08:10:50 PM »
He's got another "Hatch" to blow up now too! :)

Episode 3x21 / Re: Where Does Locke Fit In?
« on: May 23, 2007, 08:04:52 PM »
Assuming he lives, I think he will appear like the cavalry at a pivotal moment and instead of helping either the Losties or the Others, will throw an entirely new monkey wrench into the mix by somehow ruining any chance for ANYONE to get off the island, doing whatever it takes to make sure he (Locke) is able to stay and the outside world will not interfere. He is on his own journey now.

I can't wait.  I know that we all have such high hopes for this finale that it is kind of nerve-wracking-how can it live up to our expectations!?  I hope there is a minimum of Jack centric angst, but if it is done well, who cares! 

I'll be sitting down with a big bag of chips and primed, DVR remote in hand, to (hopefully) be perplexed enough with the "answers" (which always invite more questions!) that it'll keep me thinking until January.

Bring it on!!!!!  WooHoooo!

Episode 3x21 / Re: Do you trust juliet?
« on: May 22, 2007, 11:51:20 AM »
I love her tho..evil or not...I think she has been a great addition to the show.  I like to think that she is trapped on the island, and will do WHATEVER she has to do to get off the damn Rock!  If that mean she has to lie along the way, so be it.

I liked Juliette too, but after I rationalize what she says and does and her motives......I can't help but despise her. She just lies way too much, doesn't seem to really care about people, and betrays people. I find her personality contradicts even: off the island she was a messed up timid woman, on the island she a strong but untrust worthy manipulator. It's funny how she seems like she was a good person off the island, but now she seems like a bad person.

I don't mean to rain on your parade if you like Juliette, but that just my opinion. She strikes me as one of those women I'd be interesting in, but when I find out more about her all the red flags tells me to stay away because she's trouble and can't be trusted.

Great catch Blitz Wing!!  You are absolutely right that she still sees herself as a part of Ben's team and this slip is exactly the kind of things interrogation experts (like Sayid who was standing there by the way) would notice.  I think Sayid knows she is not entirely to be trusted and that was the proof.  I also believe that Ben is using her again to further his own agenda and she is entirely expendable in his eyes and yes, she may die in the finale.  I don't like the qualities of her character, but the character does add so much to the depth of the show and she is a great actress to evoke such passionate discussions about her loyalties.  Add me to the "don't trust her" side.

Episode 3x21 / Re: Self-fulfilling Prophecy
« on: May 22, 2007, 11:28:39 AM »
I think Desmond has a larger role in the scheme than we might realize.  He may be the wild card factor in the time/space scenario of the fate of Craphole Island.  I think Mrs Hawking was trying to convince Des of the futility of trying to change the outcome but she was really fearful that he Could change it and was trying to dissuade him from any kind of free thought on the subject.  Actually, she did say if he changed the future "we" would all be dead, whoever she was referring to as "we". (my thought, original native others a la Richard Alpert) but she wanted him to think "we" as in the world so he would be afraid and stay in line.

Back to the subject of the thread, I think that Desmond and Charlie had to form a bond and yes, it was a self fulfilling prophecy in a sense.  Another poster said that Charlie would never have volunteered to swim to the Looking Glass if Des hadn't gained his trust from earlier experiences.

I may sound nuts, but did anyone else notice the parallel between the scene in "Flashes Before Your Eyes" where Desmond suddenly realizes in the bar that he CAN change the future and then gets hit by the bat---and his decision in "Greatest Hits" to take Charlie's place (because he now knows he can change the future) and then WHAMBO he gets hit with a large wooden implement again? I think he knows he can change the future so he decides to take the chance and sacrifice himself instead. But the world has a way of course correcting.....

I know from the preview that Des ends up in the Looking Glass station, but wouldn't it be cool if the next time we see Des he is lying on the floor of the bar again?

Episode 3x20 / Re: Everyone hates Mikhail...
« on: May 12, 2007, 02:46:09 PM »
I think Mikhail is a "necessary evil" to the Others' group-he is the one with the tech know how to run the "coms" etc.  They don't like him but he fills a need. He does have a superior attitude and I'm sure that may be a part of why Tom and Richard and the rest just stood there or drank coffee instead of helping him.  AND they were secretly glad that Locke was taking care of business so Ben couldn't avoid taking him to see JACOB.

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