Sledgeweb's Lost ... Stuff Forum

Episode Discussion (Spoiler Free) => Season 3 => Episode 3x09 => Topic started by: JBRam on February 21, 2007, 11:31:19 PM

Title: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: JBRam on February 21, 2007, 11:31:19 PM
My guess is Cindy is NOT an Other.

What did Carl mean about the kids having a better life?
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: lostatsea on February 22, 2007, 12:01:19 AM
Cindy acted as if nothing was wrong with going from a airline stewartess to a refugee on some weird unknown island
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: esque0 on February 22, 2007, 12:02:16 AM
My guess is Cindy is NOT an Other.

What did Carl mean about the kids having a better life?

Agreed, Cindy seems just to have bought into the Others' way of life.  Not surprising, since she got to see that the Kids are OK.  

But Karl, he's been brainwashed, so he could mean anything.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: HanginWithMrEko on February 22, 2007, 12:03:47 AM
Cindy also went from a dingy cave where ppl were dying to a good society where they took care of her...

You got to remember that when they took claire, she was buying into it too
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: nothingbutsky on February 22, 2007, 12:13:52 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"They're not...it's complicated".

They're not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: AmazonMonkey on February 22, 2007, 12:16:36 AM
My guess is Cindy is NOT an Other.

What did Carl mean about the kids having a better life?


For one what has gone on with the Beach and Hatch with people dying, fighting, lighting things on fire and what not is not exactly conducive with child   appropriate exaple.

Also they were flying ALONE to Cali from Sydney... Umm something tells me their real life back home was not exactly stable or normal. 
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: AmazonMonkey on February 22, 2007, 12:18:23 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"Their not...it's complicated".

Their not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???

Lets see, get killed/tortured or get a free house, with a back yard, and no taxes in a nice stable nuclear community with none of the evils that society has manifested in the real world.  If I was her I would have chosen door #2 AS WELL.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 22, 2007, 12:19:56 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"Their not...it's complicated".

Their not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???

It is getting frustrating that we are just not told anything!! Just spit it out Cindy, now we won't see her again for 2 seasons.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: madmax22e on February 22, 2007, 12:21:12 AM
Remember, they only take "the good people."
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: esque0 on February 22, 2007, 12:23:29 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"Their not...it's complicated".

Their not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???

It is getting frustrating that we are just not told anything!! Just spit it out Cindy, now we won't see her again for 2 seasons.

"They're not ... it's complicated" is all we really needed.  It's clear what Cindy would need to explain to Jack in that situation.  the Others aren't what he thinks.  They're not evil or diabolical; they're misunderstood and complicated.  Exactly how they're complicated can be explained by anyone, but we're already getting a good sense.  Cindy can go away and never come back for all I care.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: lostatsea on February 22, 2007, 12:25:02 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"Their not...it's complicated".

Their not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???

It is getting frustrating that we are just not told anything!! Just spit it out Cindy, now we won't see her again for 2 seasons.
No one on this show ever asks the right questions at the right time. Instead we get comments like Jack's "I think I want to go back to my cage now" Why can't anyone sit down with these people and ask the million questions that could answer the who, what, when, where, why of these weird people on this island. One question I now have, is there a landscaper to ahndle all the grass cutting in those backyards?
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: esque0 on February 22, 2007, 12:26:46 AM
No one on this show ever asks the right questions at the right time. Instead we get comments like Jack's "I think I want to go back to my cage now" Why can't anyone sit down with these people and ask the million questions that could answer the who, what, when, where, why of these weird people on this island. One question I now have, is there a landscaper to ahndle all the grass cutting in those backyards?

Yes!  The worst, in my opinion, was when Jack had Friendly in the operating room alone with Ben bleeding out.  Maybe, just maybe, it's time to bring up some questions.  When he finally got around to asking one, it was too late.  Nobody seems to care about all the Dharma crap.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Pandora on February 22, 2007, 12:31:05 AM
So much for all the answers we were supposed to get this episode!  WTH... "It's complicated" and "We work on projects"?? !
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 22, 2007, 12:42:26 AM
You have CIndy right there. Ask her some questions instead he yells GO WATCH SOMEthing or something as lame. Ask some questions.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Kurtis on February 22, 2007, 12:49:53 AM
Jack's response was reasonable -  he was pissed off becuase he assumed they knew how Ana Lucia died, and were playing yet more mind games with him. If this wasn't network tv, I'm sure he would have said something stronger than "go watch something."

I liked the part where he listed all of the bad things the Others have done to the survivors. Of course, that could have been said 9 episodes ago... 
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: madmax22e on February 22, 2007, 12:52:47 AM
I was thinking that about saying something worse during that part to.

I really wanted him to just say "Cindy, GO F**K YOURSELF"
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: madmax22e on February 22, 2007, 12:53:35 AM
Anyone else notice that Jack has an anger problem? Whenever he is reunited with someone he knew after a long time, he talks for a few seconds in a normal tone and then just starts shouting. Like with Kate and Cindy.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: LouE68 on February 22, 2007, 01:01:12 AM
What the he!! was she going to say?

"Their not...it's complicated".

Their not what!? Evil? Human? Alive? Jeez, spit it out already! ??? >:( ???

It is getting frustrating that we are just not told anything!! Just spit it out Cindy, now we won't see her again for 2 seasons.
If we are lucky enough to get two more seasons
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: uofapiglet on February 22, 2007, 01:57:27 AM
So much for all the answers we were supposed to get this episode!  WTH... "It's complicated" and "We work on projects"?? !

My senitments exactly... ((((((((((Pandy))))))))))) Missed ya dude! :)
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: uofapiglet on February 22, 2007, 01:59:38 AM
I was thinking that about saying something worse during that part to.

I really wanted him to just say "Cindy, GO F**K YOURSELF"

ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Anyway, I wonder why Jack didn't tell her the truth about Ana-Lucia because he thought that they would've known about it already... or maybe he just didn't want to say anything in front of the kids...

Creepy kids and their teddy bears... :P
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: madmax22e on February 22, 2007, 02:09:34 AM
I was thinking that about saying something worse during that part to.

I really wanted him to just say "Cindy, GO F**K YOURSELF"

ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Anyway, I wonder why Jack didn't tell her the truth about Ana-Lucia because he thought that they would've known about it already... or maybe he just didn't want to say anything in front of the kids...

Creepy kids and their teddy bears... :P

He probably believes that michael was supposed to kill ana-lucia, and could have even thought that cindy was mocking him, as in "so, what happened to ana-lucia" with sarcasm. I would have told her to f off.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: uofapiglet on February 22, 2007, 02:20:13 AM
I was thinking that about saying something worse during that part to.

I really wanted him to just say "Cindy, GO F**K YOURSELF"

ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Anyway, I wonder why Jack didn't tell her the truth about Ana-Lucia because he thought that they would've known about it already... or maybe he just didn't want to say anything in front of the kids...

Creepy kids and their teddy bears... :P

He probably believes that michael was supposed to kill ana-lucia, and could have even thought that cindy was mocking him, as in "so, what happened to ana-lucia" with sarcasm. I would have told her to f off.

Exactly, I thought that he assumed Cindy must've known about AL's death all along being a part of the Others.... so it's still up in the air whether or not we know if Cindy and the rest of the bunch truly know about the AL death/murder...
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: mindsparkle on February 22, 2007, 02:47:06 AM
I absolutely felt angry at Cindy for so casually asking how Ana was.... wtf... get out of my face, now!  Did she forget where the losties are?   Did she forget what they've been through... has her empathy button been turned off... how often does someone just walk up to another person in a CAGE and say, Hey, nice day if it doesn't rain... wtf.. get out of my face, now!   

It's all so surreal and I think Jack has his survival mode on and can't let down his guard for a moment... he's seen nothing but mind games... and these people are archaic with their branding people and eye for an eye beliefs... weird!! 

It's good to know where Cindy and the kids and probably all the others they took ended up... square meals, showers, back yards to watch stars in... how quaint... maybe they are brainwashed... maybe Cindy couldn't answer Jack because in her brainwashed state it doesn't compute... angry man, why? other, what other? ... 

very good discussion, I enjoyed reading everyone's comments... and agree with all of them... from frustration to who cares...
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: DaddyBeast on February 22, 2007, 08:55:00 AM
What in the world could they have told Cindy and the kids to make them think it was ok to keep Jack in a cage??
.
It's obvious Cindy and the Kids (we need a shorter name for them) are being lied to, and now Jack knows this.  And if Jack talks to Cindy too long, he's going to have to tell her about the bad things going on, and probably put her in danger - what she doesn't know can't hurt her.

It's like the scene with Kate on the other side of the glass: once Jack found out what was up, he didn't want to say anything else that Ben could use to figure out his plans.  Jack wasn't really mad at Kate, and he's not really mad at Cindy.

(BTW - that's Cindy and Bobby in the same episode.)
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: mindsparkle on February 22, 2007, 11:35:08 AM
well, maybe we should call Cindy, and the kids and all the other kidnapped people -- the Brady bunch...
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: stillhaventfound on February 22, 2007, 01:16:15 PM
Cindy said, "We're here to watch."

What is it that they were watching or going to watch?  I think it was the trial of Juliet.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 22, 2007, 01:21:57 PM
Cindy said, "We're here to watch."

What is it that they were watching or going to watch?  I think it was the trial of Juliet.

Could of been the trial. If they were there to watch Jack, they would not of left just because Jack yelled again.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: mindsparkle on February 22, 2007, 01:23:53 PM
Exactly... Juliet's trial...
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Kosmetas on February 22, 2007, 01:44:02 PM
Also they were flying ALONE to Cali from Sydney... Umm something tells me their real life back home was not exactly stable or normal. 
They were not flying alone, their family members died in the crash or shortly after.
Title: Emma and Zack
Post by: Creflo on February 22, 2007, 02:09:54 PM
I'd like to know if the girl with Cindy who wanted to know about Ana Lucia was Emma and if the boy leering from a distance is supposed to be Zack.  These were the two primary abductees who were most closely connected to A.L.  Zack was the one with the Teddy Bear, and it may have been him seen later in "Abandoned".

They are not listed in the credits.

I'm incredulous that any kids from previous seasons could ever been seen again as the actors would be much too old.

So long, Walt!
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: DaddyBeast on February 22, 2007, 02:32:05 PM
Whenever I hear the clip from Cindy, all I remember is Chance the Gardener, "I like to watch."
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: nothingbutsky on February 22, 2007, 02:48:39 PM
And why did the Others make the kids walk through the jungle barefoot dragging the teddy bear?

Or was that an adult with the bear?
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: skbrad76 on February 22, 2007, 03:05:05 PM
I got the overwhelming sense that Cincdy was taking the children on a field trip.  It appeared that Cindy was part of a day care trip and Jack was part of the zoo.  I don't think the kids lived on the (alcatraz) island, but were brought there to watch the trial or see Jack in a cage.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: iubase28 on February 22, 2007, 03:22:27 PM
And why did the Others make the kids walk through the jungle barefoot dragging the teddy bear?

Or was that an adult with the bear?

I wondered the same thing, if the kids have a better life then why would they be walking through the jungle and from what i remember wearing rags?  Also i think in that scene the losties started hearing voices and weird smokey noises so they hid, then they saw the children.  Who knows maybe it was smokey acting as the children???
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Schmoe on February 22, 2007, 03:46:47 PM
That's a good point about smokey.  Maybe Ben and Company control smokey to do some of their dirty work and to throw people off with other images.

Unfortunately, I am also concerned that it is just a case of the writers not having all of the details worked out when they put stuff in during the first two seasons and now we may have some inconsistencies.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: KateReallyLovesJack on February 23, 2007, 12:00:42 AM
I can't make up my mind as to what they were there to watch. If they were there to watch Jack, I agree with whoever said that they wouldn't have left just because he yelled at them. But I also don't think that the others would want to have Cindy and the Kids at one of their trials - or would they?  Scare them into behaving? Show them what real justice should be?
I just can't figure it out.
Jack?
The trial?
Or something else?
 ???
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Creflo on February 23, 2007, 09:17:34 AM
What would Patchy McCreep or the guy who mans the Pearl say if you asked them why they were there at their stations?

"We're here to watch."
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Kosmetas on February 23, 2007, 01:12:13 PM
I can't make up my mind as to what they were there to watch. If they were there to watch Jack, I agree with whoever said that they wouldn't have left just because he yelled at them. But I also don't think that the others would want to have Cindy and the Kids at one of their trials - or would they?  Scare them into behaving? Show them what real justice should be?
I just can't figure it out.
Jack?
The trial?
Or something else?
 ???
Carl did mention there would be no moon that night, maybe they were there to watch some stars and maybe even make up some names for a few constellations.

Cindy, the two kids and the 10 other adults standing in the courtyard are there for the reading of Julietís verdict.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: WhatThe on February 23, 2007, 04:17:01 PM
I can't really blame Jack for not asking more questions anymore...I mean it's not as if anyone in the Others' camp every actually ANSWERS questions directly. Hell, if you ever ask any of them who exactly they are, all you'll get in response is a calm "We're the good guys" lol. Either that, or you'll get "Patience, Jack..."...or they just walk away silently without even acknowledging a question was asked.

Who we should really be pissed off at are Jack and Kate for not grilling Carl. His bond and loyalty to the Others was already non-exitent BEFORE they let him leave the group. Now they had him alone and on the main island, and all they got out of him was that they live on the main island, do projects and have backyards? And Kate acting angry because Sawyer let him go..."we could have gotten more info from him". Oh, like the entire boat ride and time spent setting up camp did NOT allow you enough time to ask him question? You wanted instead to wait until some unspecified later time to do so? Please.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: T Mack on February 24, 2007, 08:06:06 PM
I can't really blame Jack for not asking more questions anymore...I mean it's not as if anyone in the Others' camp every actually ANSWERS questions directly. Hell, if you ever ask any of them who exactly they are, all you'll get in response is a calm "We're the good guys" lol. Either that, or you'll get "Patience, Jack..."...or they just walk away silently without even acknowledging a question was asked.

Who we should really be pissed off at are Jack and Kate for not grilling Carl. His bond and loyalty to the Others was already non-exitent BEFORE they let him leave the group. Now they had him alone and on the main island, and all they got out of him was that they live on the main island, do projects and have backyards? And Kate acting angry because Sawyer let him go..."we could have gotten more info from him". Oh, like the entire boat ride and time spent setting up camp did NOT allow you enough time to ask him question? You wanted instead to wait until some unspecified later time to do so? Please. 

This show is getting more incredulous by the week.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 24, 2007, 09:16:38 PM
I can't really blame Jack for not asking more questions anymore...I mean it's not as if anyone in the Others' camp every actually ANSWERS questions directly. Hell, if you ever ask any of them who exactly they are, all you'll get in response is a calm "We're the good guys" lol. Either that, or you'll get "Patience, Jack..."...or they just walk away silently without even acknowledging a question was asked.

Who we should really be pissed off at are Jack and Kate for not grilling Carl. His bond and loyalty to the Others was already non-exitent BEFORE they let him leave the group. Now they had him alone and on the main island, and all they got out of him was that they live on the main island, do projects and have backyards? And Kate acting angry because Sawyer let him go..."we could have gotten more info from him". Oh, like the entire boat ride and time spent setting up camp did NOT allow you enough time to ask him question? You wanted instead to wait until some unspecified later time to do so? Please.

Except that Carl was passed out for most of the boat ride and early when they were making camp. Kate was the one grilling him and found out about the village on their island. So she was doing what you wanted. Sawyer was the wuss who let him go.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: KateReallyLovesJack on February 24, 2007, 09:33:42 PM
lol, Carl doesn't seem to be all with it - too much brainwashing perhaps? He probably doesn't know what the hell is going on anyways!

Hmm, I wonder if Carl and Alex are related? Maybe Danielle has had another baby since she crashed on the island (I mean, she isn't exactly all with it herself). That would be weird of course, but makes sense as to why Ben wants them apart. Just tossing it out there, haven't given it much thought...
 ???
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: WhatThe on February 25, 2007, 01:31:26 AM
I can't really blame Jack for not asking more questions anymore...I mean it's not as if anyone in the Others' camp every actually ANSWERS questions directly. Hell, if you ever ask any of them who exactly they are, all you'll get in response is a calm "We're the good guys" lol. Either that, or you'll get "Patience, Jack..."...or they just walk away silently without even acknowledging a question was asked.

Who we should really be pissed off at are Jack and Kate for not grilling Carl. His bond and loyalty to the Others was already non-exitent BEFORE they let him leave the group. Now they had him alone and on the main island, and all they got out of him was that they live on the main island, do projects and have backyards? And Kate acting angry because Sawyer let him go..."we could have gotten more info from him". Oh, like the entire boat ride and time spent setting up camp did NOT allow you enough time to ask him question? You wanted instead to wait until some unspecified later time to do so? Please.

Except that Carl was passed out for most of the boat ride and early when they were making camp. Kate was the one grilling him and found out about the village on their island. So she was doing what you wanted. Sawyer was the wuss who let him go.
She got nothing from him, though, outside of there being a village on the island. Whoopie lol. And apparently she stopped asking him questions, and never thought about asking WHAT projects they did, how HE got there, WHO exactly Ben was, WHAT the hatches were there for, WHY they wanted the three of them, WHAT they wanted Walt for, WHO kept dropping food supplies...etc, etc, yadda yadda. If the only thing she could get out of him was that, yes, they live in houses and not caves, then she wasn't trying very hard.

Let's face it, the show has never shown any of the crash survivors all too eager to find answers...and the logic behind letting Carl go was flawed from one episode to the next. Juliet told Alex she couldn't go with Carl because if Ben woke up from surgery and she wasn't there, he would find and kill Carl. It was the reason she let him go, because she knew it would save his life. But then Sawyer lets Carl go once they have him alone and away from the Others...because he says he's a "target" for the Others? Okaay...lol...I guess Alex stayed behind for no reason in Sawyers' eyes.
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 25, 2007, 01:35:04 AM
If numbnuts sawyer wouldn't of let Carl go then Brilliant Kate would of had more time to ask him questions. She was working him and Sawyer (as usual) blew it. ;D
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: WhatThe on February 25, 2007, 01:39:11 AM
If numbnuts sawyer wouldn't of let Carl go then Brilliant Kate would of had more time to ask him questions. She was working him and Sawyer (as usual) blew it. ;D

LoL...Hell, I would have asked Carl about 57 questions in between the time he came to consciousness and the time we reached the beach. She was too busy yelling "We have to get Jack! Turn the boat around!"....F*** Jack, I want some answers, dammit!
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: jugdish on February 25, 2007, 01:45:44 AM
He said He loves you as he loved Jacob and passed out again. No time for the brilliant Kate to ask him anything
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: WhatThe on February 25, 2007, 01:47:40 AM
He said He loves you as he loved Jacob and passed out again. No time for the brilliant Kate to ask him anything

He also said that Ben would kill them if they returned...Sawyer said "See?" and kept going towards the beach. Me, I would have lept up and slapped his stupid face to wake him back up if he started slipping back into naptime, then said "WTF IS GOING ON HERE?!".
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Sunflower on February 25, 2007, 02:10:26 AM
He said He loves you as he loved Jacob and passed out again. No time for the brilliant Kate to ask him anything

He also said that Ben would kill them if they returned...Sawyer said "See?" and kept going towards the beach. Me, I would have lept up and slapped his stupid face to wake him back up if he started slipping back into naptime, then said "WTF IS GOING ON HERE?!".
Hey, I like the way you think!
Title: Re: Cindy and the Kids
Post by: Creflo on February 26, 2007, 10:50:26 AM
One thing to consider is that in asking certain questions, you're tipping your hand to the questionee.
Sayid would know this. 

"What's the deal with the hatches?"
(The Losties have located at least one other hatch besides the one they foolishly took Ben to)

"Are you part of the DHARMA Initiative?"
(The Losties are aware of the D.I.)



Sure, Carl appears to be a knucklehead kid who probably knows little about the real operation, but with the way things have been going, if I were a Lostie, I would ALWAYS be suspicious of a setup.  Sawyer was wise enough to smell a rat when Alex came out of the woods to "rescue" them from Pickett's charge.  "You just happen to have a boat?!"  This could've been an orchestrated maneuver to plant Carl with the Lost camp and Alex and Juliet were confederates, just like Ben and Danielle could've conspired on the snare ploy to get Ben into the hatch.

It's not likely, but you never know with these Others (and this show).