Sledgeweb's Lost ... Stuff Forum

Episode Discussion (Spoiler Free) => Season 6 => Episode 6x14 => Topic started by: Gordon Shumway on May 12, 2010, 11:00:04 AM

Title: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: Gordon Shumway on May 12, 2010, 11:00:04 AM
I hadn't seen this anywhere here, but it seems to me that Sawyer is the candidate to replace MIB (wants to leave the island) and Sheppard is the candidate to replace Jacob (wants to stay). 

Trash at will.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: james_sawyer on May 12, 2010, 11:12:42 AM
so what now jack is going to throw sawyer into the light  ???
 jacob trashing mib reminded me of sawyer thrashing jack in incident
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 12, 2010, 11:40:23 AM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: MachThree on May 12, 2010, 12:19:49 PM
After last night's episode, I think that the concept of there being a replacement for MiB is sort of nixed.  Jacob is given the mission of protecting the island until he can find someone to replace him.  But there's no notion that MiB is intended not to be permanent, etc.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: grizn0 on May 12, 2010, 12:23:00 PM
Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: MachThree on May 12, 2010, 12:25:38 PM
Heh, actually this reminds me of Lord of The Rings - return the ring to the place it was created (Mt. Doom) - only there can it be destroyed.

Return Smokey back to the light, only there can he be destroyed?  Maybe?
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: grizn0 on May 12, 2010, 12:28:46 PM
Makes sense to me. But Lost making sense is kind of an oxymoron.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 12, 2010, 02:15:38 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: Kosmetas on May 12, 2010, 02:22:16 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.
I like this theory, they have been moving us in this direction for a bit now.
Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: Writers_Strike on May 12, 2010, 02:26:12 PM
Heh, actually this reminds me of Lord of The Rings - return the ring to the place it was created (Mt. Doom) - only there can it be destroyed.

Return Smokey back to the light, only there can he be destroyed?  Maybe?
One doesn't simply smoke float into the Spring of Light
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: Madam P on May 12, 2010, 03:35:02 PM
Heh, actually this reminds me of Lord of The Rings - return the ring to the place it was created (Mt. Doom) - only there can it be destroyed.

Return Smokey back to the light, only there can he be destroyed?  Maybe?
One doesn't simply smoke float into the Spring of Light

No.  But one could go into the Spring of Light on one's own, and Smoke might follow, not knowing that it would be destroyed there.

I could see either Desmond or Sawyer or Hurley or Jack doing this.  Desmond might be the only one who could survive it, because of his "specialness" or whatever when it comes to big bright flashes of light.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 09:45:50 AM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostlady on May 13, 2010, 10:56:03 AM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2010, 11:48:36 AM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?

We don't, some of us are just taking a throw away line that Sawyer said, and making it mean way more than we know it to.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 11:51:42 AM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?

We don't know for sure if Smokey was in the cave and released when MIB went in or if MIB 'became' Smokey (another mystery!).  I read spoilers last week that said this episode would show us how Smokey was 'created', so I'm going on that clue and assuming that this was the first time Smokey existed.
As for the water, we were given the impression that Flocke couldn't fly over to the other island as the smoke monster to kill everyone, that he had to go over in physical form.  There's been debate that Smokey is somehow 'tethered' to the island and he may only be able to leave in a physical form.  This got me thinking that the purpose of sinking the island would be to trap him once and for all.  With no phsical means to leave, and the inability to travel over or through water (remember Ben's lame drain plug scene) Smokey would be trapped or killed on the submerged island.  Also, the idea that he can't die and would just be trapped leaves open the idea that he somehow could escape if the island ever rose again.  Imagine a dive expedition in the future where someone thinks they've found Atlantis and they inadvertantly provide Smokey with a way to 'come up for air'.  I hope they don't leave the show on a cliffhanger like this, but who knows, they may decide to make a movie instead after all!
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 11:57:13 AM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?

We don't, some of us are just taki9ng a throw away line that Sawyer said, and making it mean way more than we know it to.

I don't think they use many 'throw away lines' in this show.  As I said, remember the scene where Ben 'summoned' Smokey.  Smokey couldn't get into the village because of the sonic fences, but Ben let him in simply by draining a few inches of water from a little pool.  The thing can uproot trees and throw people through the air, but it can't pass through water.  That's what I took from that scene.  Lame, maybe.  Cheesy, sure.  But we've all accepted a frozen donkey wheel can move an island through space and time, right?   ;)
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2010, 12:09:17 PM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?

We don't, some of us are just taki9ng a throw away line that Sawyer said, and making it mean way more than we know it to.

I don't think they use many 'throw away lines' in this show.  As I said, remember the scene where Ben 'summoned' Smokey.  Smokey couldn't get into the village because of the sonic fences, but Ben let him in simply by draining a few inches of water from a little pool.  The thing can uproot trees and throw people through the air, but it can't pass through water.  That's what I took from that scene.  Lame, maybe.  Cheesy, sure.  But we've all accepted a frozen donkey wheel can move an island through space and time, right?   ;)

I'm talking about the line from Sawyer when he tells Jack to "...just get him in the water, and I'll take care of the rest." People are taking that line and turning it into some kind of key element about Smokey. I mean we have seen Smokey in water several times. Even when Locke came back to life after the Ajira flight, he was standing in the water eating the mango.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 01:16:41 PM
I'm thinking it's not the light that will stop MIB but the water.  He has a problem with water.  So if they can trap him somewhere like a cave where they can flood it with water, that should do it.  Gee, too bad they can't figure out a way to sink the whole island.........wait a minute......... ;)

But wasn't smokey residing in the light cave (filled with water)? Smokey has also been seen in the rain. How do we know he is repelled by water?

We don't, some of us are just taki9ng a throw away line that Sawyer said, and making it mean way more than we know it to.

I don't think they use many 'throw away lines' in this show.  As I said, remember the scene where Ben 'summoned' Smokey.  Smokey couldn't get into the village because of the sonic fences, but Ben let him in simply by draining a few inches of water from a little pool.  The thing can uproot trees and throw people through the air, but it can't pass through water.  That's what I took from that scene.  Lame, maybe.  Cheesy, sure.  But we've all accepted a frozen donkey wheel can move an island through space and time, right?   ;)

I'm talking about the line from Sawyer when he tells Jack to "...just get him in the water, and I'll take care of the rest." People are taking that line and turning it into some kind of key element about Smokey. I mean we have seen Smokey in water several times. Even when Locke came back to life after the Ajira flight, he was standing in the water eating the mango.

I know, I'm not saying that he melts like the wicked witch if he gets wet.  I'm referring to the conversation where Flocke says that if he could just 'fly over' to the Hydra island, he would.  There has been debate that smokey is somehow 'tethered' to the island and can't travel over or through water.  This was also discussed waaay back as an explanation as to why he can't just fly over the sonic fences.  So if this has any merit, my guess is that the sunken island, which I'm assuming they won't leave hanging out there at the end of the series, will be how MIB is ultimately defeated.  I'm also guessing that Desmond will be the one to sink the island.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2010, 01:25:43 PM
I know, I'm not saying that he melts like the wicked witch if he gets wet.  I'm referring to the conversation where Flocke says that if he could just 'fly over' to the Hydra island, he would.  There has been debate that smokey is somehow 'tethered' to the island and can't travel over or through water.  This was also discussed waaay back as an explanation as to why he can't just fly over the sonic fences.  So if this has any merit, my guess is that the sunken island, which I'm assuming they won't leave hanging out there at the end of the series, will be how MIB is ultimately defeated.  I'm also guessing that Desmond will be the one to sink the island.

I thought that line about flying off the island wasn't about getting from the main island to Hydra island, but about getting off the island completely.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: nomteticus on May 13, 2010, 01:31:15 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 01:32:52 PM
I know, I'm not saying that he melts like the wicked witch if he gets wet.  I'm referring to the conversation where Flocke says that if he could just 'fly over' to the Hydra island, he would.  There has been debate that smokey is somehow 'tethered' to the island and can't travel over or through water.  This was also discussed waaay back as an explanation as to why he can't just fly over the sonic fences.  So if this has any merit, my guess is that the sunken island, which I'm assuming they won't leave hanging out there at the end of the series, will be how MIB is ultimately defeated.  I'm also guessing that Desmond will be the one to sink the island.

I thought that line about flying off the island wasn't about getting from the main island to Hydra island, but about getting off the island completely.

Either way, sink the island (save the cheerleader), save the world!
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 01:34:27 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)

Yes, I would love to see someone finally have the cajones to write a story where the good guys fail and the world is destroyed!  Talk about a surprise ending with no chance of a movie option!   ;D
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2010, 01:37:49 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)

Are you thinking that's why MiB couldn't find the cave without his mother, and why she "...knows that now..." that Jacob was the one that was suppossed to be the protector??
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: Writers_Strike on May 13, 2010, 02:19:43 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)

Yes, I would love to see someone finally have the cajones to write a story where the good guys fail and the world is destroyed!  Talk about a surprise ending with no chance of a movie option!   ;D

I used to think that way until I saw The Perfect Storm. OK so the world isn't destroyed, but everyone dies and I felt it wasn't a good way to end a movie. I know it was based on a true story, but it still sucked to see them all die.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2010, 02:23:13 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)

Yes, I would love to see someone finally have the cajones to write a story where the good guys fail and the world is destroyed!  Talk about a surprise ending with no chance of a movie option!   ;D

You've seen the saw movies, right?? Bad guy deffinitely wins there.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: lostfan777 on May 13, 2010, 03:00:06 PM
I would agree, but I think the only crash survivor that is going to make it all the way to the end is going to be Jack. Whatever happens will be a big struggle between Jack and Locke/MiB.

Bring MIB back to the light and maybe he is defeated?

I think both jack and Desmond will play a hand in defeating MIB.  Desmond will be the only one able to bring him into the light without being destroyed himself.

Apparently, only the island protector can find the cave. So yeah, if Jack will be the new island protector he could lead Desmond to the cave, and Desmond could fool Smokey into entering the cave after him.
The only problem is I don't want Smokey to die, I want him to escape.  :)

Yes, I would love to see someone finally have the cajones to write a story where the good guys fail and the world is destroyed!  Talk about a surprise ending with no chance of a movie option!   ;D

You've seen the saw movies, right?? Bad guy deffinitely wins there.

Those movies aren't my type.  But I'm talking about an all out end-of-days story where the end actually comes and no one survives.  What a concept! 
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: sobrien on May 13, 2010, 05:26:42 PM
I hadn't seen this anywhere here, but it seems to me that Sawyer is the candidate to replace MIB (wants to leave the island) and Sheppard is the candidate to replace Jacob (wants to stay). 

Trash at will.

I don't think there needs to be a candidate to replace MIB.  He is the antagonist of the "protector/Jacob."  For all intents and purposes, Smokie seem immortal - he doesn't die and doesn't seem to be able to be killed; that leads me to believe he needs no replacement.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: I_Am_Jacob on May 13, 2010, 05:28:29 PM
I hadn't seen this anywhere here, but it seems to me that Sawyer is the candidate to replace MIB (wants to leave the island) and Sheppard is the candidate to replace Jacob (wants to stay). 

Trash at will.

I don't think there needs to be a candidate to replace MIB.  He is the antagonist of the "protector/Jacob."  For all intents and purposes, Smokie seem immortal - he doesn't die and doesn't seem to be able to be killed; that leads me to believe he needs no replacement.

Yeah I agree with this here. I am not sold that a way to defeat MiB will not ever be found, but I don't think a replacement is needed.
Title: Re: Candidate Sawyer and Candidate Sheppard
Post by: I_Am_Jacob on May 13, 2010, 05:29:19 PM
900. At this rate I'll definately hit my goal.