Sledgeweb's Lost ... Stuff Forum

Episode Discussion (Spoiler Free) => Season 6 => Episode 6x08 => Topic started by: Jungle Otter on March 23, 2010, 10:29:34 PM

Title: Black Rock
Post by: Jungle Otter on March 23, 2010, 10:29:34 PM
Prison ship - headed to the "New World" of Australia.  ;D You heard it here first....  :D

As the ship was heading to Australia, it's my belief she was a prison ship even tho Locke said slaves. During the 18th and early 19th century, to alleviate over crowded prisons, sentences were pased sending criminals to the colony of Australia to populate the place. After a year or more of indentured servitude, you went free to do as you will. The mining equipment is another clue. There is book entitled The Floating Brothel that gives the story of one such ship.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: JBRam on March 23, 2010, 10:50:07 PM
Also, I noticed that it is unlikely the ship we saw in the S5 finale was the Black Rock.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Jungle Otter on March 23, 2010, 11:12:03 PM
Very true. So which ship was that I wonder.....
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: bluesmanjay on March 23, 2010, 11:13:04 PM
Also, I noticed that it is unlikely the ship we saw in the S5 finale was the Black Rock.

Just thought the same thing myself. I wonder what that ship was.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: PILOT on March 23, 2010, 11:13:31 PM
agreed,black rock came at night, s5 ship came in nice and safe during the day
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: JMart on March 23, 2010, 11:18:23 PM
perhaps it turned to night just like ajira did... :D



Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: jamesl on March 23, 2010, 11:33:16 PM
Jacob and MIB have super vision (like superman) so they saw the ship when it was far out at sea, before the storm
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Jungle Otter on March 23, 2010, 11:38:25 PM
The ship was on the horizon so its possible it didn't actually go to the island. however, perhaps Jacob had a parley with someone on board
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Folly529 on March 23, 2010, 11:39:47 PM
Or, as Jacob said - I brought you to the Island - the Storm may have been the method for bringing the ship in
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: CastawayCayley on March 23, 2010, 11:48:27 PM
The ship was on the horizon so its possible it didn't actually go to the island. however, perhaps Jacob had a parley with someone on board

Parley? Damn to the depths whatever man what thought of "Parley".
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: on the island on March 23, 2010, 11:54:17 PM
So how did the Black Rock end up in the middle of the island?  A wave?
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: TXFlyboy on March 23, 2010, 11:55:29 PM
Surf's up dude
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: jugdish on March 23, 2010, 11:56:43 PM
Showed the marks on the ground. The waves must of pushed it inward.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on March 24, 2010, 12:00:38 AM
I doubt that the first mate would pay a cash bribe to take a condemned man from the gallows, or give a durn whether he spoke English if Australia was the destination.

Also, I though Australians were "Prisoners of His/Her Majesty" (hence the derogatory term "pohmmies")...were these Spaniards on an English territory?


The purpose of the journey was to land at The New World with indentured servants grateful to have their lives spared.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: TXFlyboy on March 24, 2010, 12:05:29 AM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: MachThree on March 24, 2010, 12:08:02 AM
Also, I though Australians were "Prisoners of His/Her Majesty" (hence the derogatory term "pohmmies")

I believe it was P.O.M.E - Prisoner of Mother England
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on March 24, 2010, 12:21:36 AM
Thanks for the correction...only knew the reference from the Monty Python "Philosopher Drinking Song" which, coincidentally enough, is how I learned the name...

"David Hume could outconsume..."
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Bostonlost on March 24, 2010, 12:24:40 AM
From Lostpedia

The subtitle at the beginning of Richard's flashback places the events in 1867, yet the final voyage of the Black Rock was previously stated to have occurred on 22 March 1845 (4x05).
The date may have given as 1867 to address another continuity error. The Black Rock had crates of dynamite. Alfred Nobel didn't patent dynamite until 1867.

So that would put Richards age around 150 to 170 years old
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: LouE68 on March 24, 2010, 01:13:51 AM
Also, I noticed that it is unlikely the ship we saw in the S5 finale was the Black Rock.
The original ship Magnus Hanso was one?
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: bastor on March 24, 2010, 11:23:59 AM
The Black Rock obviously can not have been the ship in S5.
Mid-day =/= Night
Sunny and peaceful =/= Stormy...and hurricany xD

It becomes fairly obvious that Jacob has brought not only one ship or vessel to the island so the ship in S05 might not even matter for all we know.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Folly529 on March 24, 2010, 11:32:36 AM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific
That's assuming that the Island has been in the Pacific the whole time - I don't think we can guarantee that.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Beej on March 25, 2010, 11:19:38 AM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific

I'm with you, if the black Rock was going to America, it was very ''LOST''

Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on March 25, 2010, 01:52:49 PM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific

I'm with you, if the black Rock was going to America, it was very ''LOST''



I think you're misreading the intent of this quote.  He was saying that if they were headed to Australia, they are way off.

Think about it: from Europe to the Canary Islands to the New World is a straightforward journey across a single ocean.  It would be a trip to Australia that would take them around the Horn of Africa.

Besides, the first mate specifically stated that the New World was the destination, and nobody pays for a condemned man just to take him from the gallows to a penal colony.

They were headed to America to mine.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: ukslim on March 25, 2010, 02:11:27 PM
Bear in mind, the island moves. It could have been in the Atlantic at the time.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: solost on March 25, 2010, 02:15:21 PM
It has been showen the Black Rock sailed from England in 1845 and disappeared. In this EP, Richard rides up to his house and the caption says ".........1867. This is a difference of 22 years! Is this a ERROR?
Could it be that the Black Rock has been acting like the DHARMA sub? Could it in fact have not disappeared, but was sailing around the world bringing people to the island just like the DHarma sun.
This would explain the difference from the first time we saw the ship when Jacob and MIB were sitting on the beach. What do you all think?
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: DirtyMaggieMae on March 25, 2010, 03:41:33 PM
I took it that Jacob saw the ship and then was able to conjure up a storm to bring the ship in.  This is pretty much what the producers said in the recent podcast, I wish I had a link!  I don't think that they were meant to be taken as two different ships, I think we were meant to ascertain that Jacob uses his abilities to draw people to the island.
 It reminds me of a time long ago when there was all the buzz of DHARMA controlling the weather, like when Locke predicts the rainfalls. 
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on March 27, 2010, 02:29:22 PM
It has been showen the Black Rock sailed from England in 1845 and disappeared. In this EP, Richard rides up to his house and the caption says ".........1867. This is a difference of 22 years! Is this a ERROR?

This was the error (1845) originally.  Then it was pointed out that dynamite wasn't invented until the 1860's, so they course corrected.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: JMart on March 27, 2010, 03:00:00 PM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific

unless the island was elsewhere back then since we know it moves.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: LouE68 on March 27, 2010, 08:23:09 PM
Is it possible that there could have been several trips to the island too...I also took the voyage to Australia to be a ruse....
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Abaddons Key on March 30, 2010, 02:20:43 PM
Well it must have been quite a voyage.  If the ship picked up Richard in the Canary Islands (which are in the Atlantic just off the northwest coast of Africa) they made a hell of a trip around the horn of Africa and out into the Pacific

I'm with you, if the black Rock was going to America, it was very ''LOST''


Just like their flight 815 was 3 hours off course or something around that number.  That was given by the pilot in the... well the pilot :)
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on April 27, 2010, 11:59:29 PM
Now we know per popup
Set sail for final voyage 1845
Picked up Richie some time in 1847
Was heading for Siam (as Thailand was known then...Phuket anyone?)

Siam was the only nation in that area that resisted colonial rule.


I think night fell and the storm set in after the beach scene from s5.  Time is weird on The Island and it gives everyone a hard time when they enter the dome.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: RM on April 28, 2010, 03:27:55 AM
The Pop-up reconfirmed that the Black Rock departed from England March 22, 1845.  But it was 1867 -- 22 years later for some reason -- when they picked up Richard.  (People have said that the date change was a cover for a script error since dynamite hadn't been created in 1845.)

------

P.S.  I'm slow.  I only just now got the "joke" that "Black Rock" ties in with the "every man is a scale" (with a white rock and a black rock on it).
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: lostfromthestart on April 28, 2010, 08:52:55 AM
Now we know per popup
Set sail for final voyage 1845
Picked up Richie some time in 1847
Was heading for Siam (as Thailand was known then...Phuket anyone?)

Siam was the only nation in that area that resisted colonial rule.


I think night fell and the storm set in after the beach scene from s5.  Time is weird on The Island and it gives everyone a hard time when they enter the dome.

Jacob and MIB saw the ship passing in the daytime.  Jacob could have waited for night before having the storm drag the ship back to the island.  Or he could have moved the island ahead into the ship's path before setting the storm off.

It seemed like the ship was too close when we saw it in S5 final to have the storm hit "right then" to drag it over.
Title: Re: Black Rock
Post by: Creflo on April 28, 2010, 11:35:36 AM
Quote
But it was 1867 ...
Ooops.  That's right.

The ship was some distance away, but is was broad daylight.
(http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100327152205/lostpedia/images/thumb/d/da/Normal_theincident012.jpg/250px-Normal_theincident012.jpg)

It's at least as close as the freighter. Seems like there were distortions of time as they approached The Island from the freighter via the ship's tender or the chopper?