Sledgeweb's Lost ... Stuff Forum

Episode Discussion (Spoiler Free) => Season 5 => Episode 5x15 => Topic started by: kjenkins on May 07, 2009, 04:26:52 PM

Title: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: kjenkins on May 07, 2009, 04:26:52 PM
What exactly is Daniel's plan for the bomb .... light fuse "at just the right time" ... then --- RUN LIKE HELL!!!!
How does that work?
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Jungle Otter on May 07, 2009, 04:41:08 PM
Set a timer?? Good question as the blast would most likely consume the island


Run away!! Run away!!!  :D
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: TheBrightandTheDark on May 07, 2009, 04:44:07 PM
Well, if the movie Deja Vu is any indication, the people on the island will sacrifice themselves in the bomb-explosion, but they'll really never die if that sets up an alternate timeline because the Swan will never be built and their plane will never crash and they'll never go to the island to be sent back in time and killed in the bomb-explosion.  :-\
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: RM on May 07, 2009, 09:14:12 PM
I don't know.  It seems like what sends people time-jumping is the release of the EM energy.  So when the plan to detonate the bomb fails (like I think it will) and the Swan Incident still happens, I fully expect all of our Losties to time-jump yet again.  (To when, who knows?)

Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: joshzam on May 08, 2009, 06:26:35 AM
I expect Jack to accomplish his mission by setting off the detonation close to the source of the electromagnetic radiation under the Swan, and THIS is what later must be contained by pushing the button every 108 minutes. So, in an attempt to prevent the crash of 815, Jack CAUSES it! Whatever happened happened.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Writers_Strike on May 08, 2009, 08:09:51 AM
Plan for the bomb:

Step 1. Find the bomb-check
Step 2. Read the journal on what to do next-check
Step 3. Realize you do not have the specialized equipment, firing mechanism, firing sequence or training-check

Give up and become the cause of the incident you were trying to prevent.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: GUTZandRAGE on May 08, 2009, 08:37:58 AM
I still do not fully understand what they are trying to do. Did Daniel want to detonate the bomb and just wipe out the island completely? Is the H-bomb supposed to counter the electro-magnetic discharge? I mean, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Supposedly the energy was discharged, bad stuff happened, and the Swan station was built to keep it contained. However, Miles' dad seemed pretty surprised when Daniel told him about the possible catastrophe, but we saw that rat-bastard Radzinski already had a model for the Swan.

If the Swan was built to contain a disaster that had not happened, why was it already planned? And how the hell is a huge bomb any better?

This is more of a Michael Bay answer to the problem than that of a scientist. But what can you expect from an egghead who walks into an enemy camp waving a loaded gun?
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Writers_Strike on May 08, 2009, 08:55:35 AM
Dan said that he could negate the energy from the incident with the H-bomb. Or something along those lines I still don't know how that is supposed to work. Now to pull off a Star Trek answer, detonating the bomb will kill off everyone and everything on the island. The DI will never put a swan there and 815 will fly harmlessly over glowing island. All of our time traveling heroes, dead 815'rs, Henry Gale, Russoes team, crazy guy who told Hurley about numbers and numerous other People affected or killed by the island will go on living their life as if they never went there. OK so a few DI and others will be vaporized and killed off, they were going to die in '92 anyways. The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: BobBX542 on May 08, 2009, 11:18:53 AM
The bomb would not kill everyone on the island, expecially if it's underground.

Best example as far as I can tell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qp6aZIhHiRE

Many more I'm sure to follow on here.
http://www.google.com/search?q=underground+Hydrogen+bomb+test&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1

As far as lighting the fuse at "just the right time", I don't think that's going to matter really. The only deadline they have in 1977 is before the D.I. drills into the electromagnetic energy (so far). So, as long as they get there and set it off at all, they're good.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: ukslim on May 08, 2009, 11:24:24 AM
I think (as far as Jack and maybe Sayid are concerned) it's a suicide mission. They die in the blast. But (Jack thinks) it won't matter because "none of this will have happened", so he doesn't really die, he never comes to the island.

I think he's wrong, of course.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Austruck on May 08, 2009, 11:34:27 AM
I expect Jack to accomplish his mission by setting off the detonation close to the source of the electromagnetic radiation under the Swan, and THIS is what later must be contained by pushing the button every 108 minutes. So, in an attempt to prevent the crash of 815, Jack CAUSES it! Whatever happened happened.
I really like this explanation, for some reason, and wondered about it myself. Glad to see I'm not the only one who thought of this.  :D
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: LostGirlDeb on May 08, 2009, 12:00:49 PM
I think (as far as Jack and maybe Sayid are concerned) it's a suicide mission. They die in the blast. But (Jack thinks) it won't matter because "none of this will have happened", so he doesn't really die, he never comes to the island.

I think he's wrong, of course.

well yeah he is wrong because he tells Sayid that Eloise will send them back 30 yrs from now
Doesn't that mean that his plan will not work?  If he never crashes he will never need to be sent back
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: BobBX542 on May 08, 2009, 01:36:12 PM
I think (as far as Jack and maybe Sayid are concerned) it's a suicide mission. They die in the blast. But (Jack thinks) it won't matter because "none of this will have happened", so he doesn't really die, he never comes to the island.

I think he's wrong, of course.

well yeah he is wrong because he tells Sayid that Eloise will send them back 30 yrs from now
Doesn't that mean that his plan will not work?  If he never crashes he will never need to be sent back

That was the point of the episode from last week called the variable. It is possible for the 815 survivors to change things, but they have to actually do it first, because it's their present.

Sort of like the time machine idea. I have the idea to make a time machine, and then suddenly, a time machine appears in front of me and I step out of it. Now, did the time machine appear because I had the thought to make it, and in the future, I went back to say that it worked, OR, did I have the thought, and in thirty years I make it and then come back?? It's all about the action or inaction that they do "NOW" that affects the future.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Writers_Strike on May 08, 2009, 01:38:08 PM
The bomb would not kill everyone on the island, expecially if it's underground.

Best example as far as I can tell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qp6aZIhHiRE

Many more I'm sure to follow on here.
http://www.google.com/search?q=underground+Hydrogen+bomb+test&rls=com.microsoft:en-us&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&startIndex=&startPage=1

As far as lighting the fuse at "just the right time", I don't think that's going to matter really. The only deadline they have in 1977 is before the D.I. drills into the electromagnetic energy (so far). So, as long as they get there and set it off at all, they're good.

Those bombs were detonated very far below the ground and smaller then Jughead is.

From Wikipedia "Plumbbob Rainier was detonated at 899 ft underground on 19 September 1957. The 1.7 kt explosion was the first to be entirely contained underground, producing no fallout."

Jughead was expected to be 7Mt according to http://lost.cubit.net/forum/index.php?topic=8459.0 (http://lost.cubit.net/forum/index.php?topic=8459.0)
A 1,700 ton explosion at 900 feet produces no ill effects. But a 7,000,000 ton explosion at 50-100 feet will kill everyone on the island.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: ukslim on May 08, 2009, 01:44:33 PM
That was the point of the episode from last week called the variable. It is possible for the 815 survivors to change things, but they have to actually do it first, because it's their present.

I don't think they can. Dan had the desperate last ditch theory that they could - but my guess is he's wrong.

Partly because it's a literary mainstay - try to beat fate, but you can't.
Partly because I can't see how TPTB can 'undo' all of the facts about the world post 1977 that we've already seen on screen, without it, well, being lame.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: BobBX542 on May 08, 2009, 01:49:06 PM
That was the point of the episode from last week called the variable. It is possible for the 815 survivors to change things, but they have to actually do it first, because it's their present.

I don't think they can. Dan had the desperate last ditch theory that they could - but my guess is he's wrong.

Partly because it's a literary mainstay - try to beat fate, but you can't.
Partly because I can't see how TPTB can 'undo' all of the facts about the world post 1977 that we've already seen on screen, without it, well, being lame.

It wouldn't undo anything, it would make something new.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: MachThree on May 08, 2009, 07:30:19 PM
To me I don't think it would matter necessarily if Jack & Co. nuked the swan right before the drilling began, or sometime afterward, in the sense that it would still be before Desmond crashed the plane and the swan and the dark matter would still be destroyed.

Except of course that if they don't do it before the drilling starts, the energy gets released and they all get injured or killed and so lose their chance to detonate the bomb.

My other theory - there never is a release of electromagnetic energy caused by the drilling - the release of the energy is from the bomb going off as caused by Jack & co. - that's what its always been.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: golfstrom on May 08, 2009, 07:47:34 PM

Step 3. Realize you do not have the specialized equipment, firing mechanism, firing sequence or training-check


I guess this is where Sayid, jack-of-all-trades, comes in handy. To some extent.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: toadsage on May 09, 2009, 02:23:45 PM
im thinking that when jack and sayid try to blow up jughead, something goes wrong and the dharma folks seal the bomb in all the concrete we saw inside the swan. when des turns the key he finally explodes the bomb, releasing the pent up energy along with the blast of the bomb.
i could be totally wrong, but this is what im feeling here.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: james_sawyer on May 09, 2009, 07:08:25 PM
Plan for the bomb:

Step 1. Find the bomb-check
Step 2. Read the journal on what to do next-check
Step 3. Realize you do not have the specialized equipment, firing mechanism, firing sequence or training-check

Give up and become the cause of the incident you were trying to prevent.


haha   :D hilarious  and i totally agree with u ..whatever happened will happen
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: BobBX542 on May 12, 2009, 01:12:13 PM
im thinking that when jack and sayid try to blow up jughead, something goes wrong and the dharma folks seal the bomb in all the concrete we saw inside the swan. when des turns the key he finally explodes the bomb, releasing the pent up energy along with the blast of the bomb.
i could be totally wrong, but this is what im feeling here.

I disagree, BUT, that is a particulary cool answer to why when Desmond turned the key that it was different than anything else we have seen so far.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: nomteticus on May 12, 2009, 08:36:18 PM
But wouldn't all the Dharma people and the Others die?
Some of them did leave via sub, but the rest of them would be exposed to nuclear holocaust!
Did Jack even think about that, or does he care only about the 815'ers?
I mean, sure, there were 324 passengers who would be saved, but that could maybe cause more dead or radiated people. From an utilitarian point of view, that doesn't work.
It's just a horrible plan. A better plan would have been to kill Radzinsky.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Maxor127 on May 13, 2009, 01:08:58 AM
Ever since Daniel's plan, I'm been theorizing that the fail-safe that gets designed into the Swan station is actually the hydrogen bomb and when Desmond turned the key, he was actually detonating the bomb and following through with Daniel's plan.  And maybe the bomb reacted with the electromagnetism in some sci-fi way that prevented it from nuking the entire island and leaving a cloud of deadly radiation and instead caused the site to implode.
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: Blitz Wing on May 13, 2009, 04:43:55 AM
Ever since Daniel's plan, I'm been theorizing that the fail-safe that gets designed into the Swan station is actually the hydrogen bomb and when Desmond turned the key, he was actually detonating the bomb and following through with Daniel's plan.  And maybe the bomb reacted with the electromagnetism in some sci-fi way that prevented it from nuking the entire island and leaving a cloud of deadly radiation and instead caused the site to implode.

I could agree with this. The Electromagnetism was at it's strongest when Desmond turned the key....it was even stronger than when it brought down flight 815. So perhaps somehow the intense electromagnetism contained the nuke.....caused the nuke to turn into an implosion somehow?
Title: Re: So What Exactly IS the Plan for the Bomb?
Post by: BobBX542 on May 13, 2009, 10:49:01 AM
Ever since Daniel's plan, I'm been theorizing that the fail-safe that gets designed into the Swan station is actually the hydrogen bomb and when Desmond turned the key, he was actually detonating the bomb and following through with Daniel's plan.  And maybe the bomb reacted with the electromagnetism in some sci-fi way that prevented it from nuking the entire island and leaving a cloud of deadly radiation and instead caused the site to implode.

It almost seems as if I've heard this somewhere before...

im thinking that when jack and sayid try to blow up jughead, something goes wrong and the dharma folks seal the bomb in all the concrete we saw inside the swan. when des turns the key he finally explodes the bomb, releasing the pent up energy along with the blast of the bomb.
i could be totally wrong, but this is what im feeling here.

Ahhhh, that's it. LOL