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Messages - Blitz Wing

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196
Episode 3x20 / Re: Fun Fact About Ben's Mother
« on: May 14, 2007, 05:01:44 AM »
I think that's a cool connection. It'd be even more cool if the young Ben actor is their kid. LOL.

197
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Gun
« on: May 14, 2007, 04:58:19 AM »
of course this could all be a production mistake  ;D

Production mistake? You mean they actually intended Alex to give the gun to Ben, but filmed it wrong.  :) That would make more sense.

Alex: "Here dad, take this gun.....you'll need it. Oh, and happy birthday!"

LOL!  :D

198
Episode 3x20 / Re: Why Jack?
« on: May 14, 2007, 04:47:50 AM »
Jack is going to come out as the hero at the end. He knows what he is doing.

I hope not, I don't like it when characters gets to a point where they're infallible.....that they can't lose even when they're wrong.

Even if Juliette proves to be on the Lostie's side now, it still doesn't change the fact that she wasn't before the Korean Woman's Sonogram......and that Jack was dead wrong at that time about Juliette, and it was only by luck that all the stuff that happened with the Korean woman that changed Juliette's mind.

I'm a guy who believes "the ends justifies the means" to a certain extent.....but even if the result turns out desirable in the end, I can't totally overlook the stupid moves made that almost made everything go wrong. In this case, Jack.

199
Episode 3x20 / Re: Everyone hates Mikhail...
« on: May 14, 2007, 04:33:41 AM »
I don't think the others hates Mikhail. Ms Clues (what's her name, the "black woman other" that Mikhail was forced to shoot).....she was hanging out with Mikhail at the Flame. Ben didn't think it was necessary for Locke to beat Mikhail senseless. Mikhail seemed emotionally concerned when Sayid told him that they killed an Other during the sailboat boarding (This emotional concern gives Mikhail's guise of being Dharma away).

It'll be interesting to see if Mikhail changes clothes now or not. He seems to like wearing the Dharma uniform. I think he looks cooler in the Dharma uniform. Maybe he wears it because he's ex-military and he feels a need to wear a uniform of some sort.....even if he's not Dharma.

200
Episode 3x20 / Re: Ben's Mom
« on: May 14, 2007, 04:01:26 AM »
I don't think it's a grown up Annie, somebody spoted the same picture in the house with young Ben.

201
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Others Are Mass Murderers
« on: May 14, 2007, 03:54:52 AM »
If you think a verbally abusive father does not harm kids, please don't have any.

If you don't think things through properly and like making emotional conclusions rather than looking at all the facts, please have somebody else teach your children to think logically.

202
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Others Are Mass Murderers
« on: May 14, 2007, 03:41:18 AM »
Ummmm. An alcoholic dad who blames his son for his wife's death during childbirth and is both verbally and emotionally abusive does not garner any sympathy from me. I don't know what whacky planet you are from Maxor, but on Earth children with fathers like Ben's generally turn out to be socially maladjusted criminals or perpetual substance abusers. Emotional abuse is jsut as bad as, if not worse than, physical abuse. Ask any child psychiatrist.

I don't think any of the evidence in the episode supports Ben's dad (Roger) openly being verbally abusive to Ben with intent to harm, or being totally uncaring of Ben. I also do not believe Roger was a stereo-typical drunk abusing dad, I think perhaps some of you may have mis-interpreted some of the scenes.

Does Roger blame Ben for his wife death? Maybe on some semi-conscious level, but I don't think Roger does it intent ally. I also do not believe Roger hates Ben......I believe Roger does care about Ben the best he can in his own way.

When Roger & Ben gets to the Island, Roger explains to young Ben what's going on (Very nice like, not in a "do what I say or I'll yell at you or beat you" way). Young Ben doesn't say much, so I would assume there's a breakdown in communication between Roger and Ben.....which may make it difficult for Roger to show that he cares for Ben. They probably don't have a close Father & Son relationship due to the lack of communication. Young Ben obviously doesn't seem scared or submissive to Roger. Young Ben simply seems like the quiet anti-social type.

It seems like Roger has a negative attitude because things are difficult for him, and his negative attitude isn't directed at young Ben (Not saying it's great for Ben, but it's not directed at Ben). Roger needed a job, couldn't find a job to support himself and Ben. Roger thought he was going to get a good job at the Dharma camp, but all he got was "Workman". Roger was upset, but he took the job anyways.

When Roger was talking to Horace about the Hostile's Attack, he was very upset that he was shot at. He's only a workman getting paid probably peanuts....and now he's getting shot at. Roger is very upset and believes he should be getting paid more if he's going to be shot at....because this isn't what he signed up for. Horace says he did Roger a favor and to think of Ben's education. Roger says he doesn't give a damn about Ben's education (ie. Those reasons aren't enough), Roger wants more money. I don't think Roger really doesn't care about Ben's education. He's just upset that he's being shot at & wants more money, and only says this in retort to Horace's remark.

So Roger kicks Horace out of his house. Young Ben stumbles.....Roger hears this, comes and checks on Ben. Roger still being upset with his discussion with Horace says to Ben "I thought I told you to goto bed" and closes the door. Roger isn't mad with Ben, Roger doesn't dominate Ben.....otherwise he would have stood there watching Ben get back into his bed before he closes the door. Roger isn't going to talk to Ben about the discussion he had with Horace, he takes on the burden himself.

Next scene we see Roger passed out on the couch after drinking. Young Ben comes in and starts to take off his shoe and put away the beer cans. Roger only has one shoe on, suggests he drank a lot and passed out. While this type of scene usually is used to portray a drunken abusive father, this doesn't necessarily mean Roger is an abusive drunken father. Roger wakes up, realizes it's Ben's birthday and has forgotten it yet again. He says matter-of-factly that it's hard to remember a day in which Ben killed his mother (Crude way to say that Ben's birth killed his wife). Roger goes on matter-of-factly and states how it happened, and says Ben just had to come early, how Ben's Mom is gone now and he's stuck on the island with Ben.....then Roger passes out again. I don't think Roger said all this with the intent of hurting Ben, Roger's drunk at this point. He just says what he's feeling crudely because he's drunk. I do note that he does put a lot of negative emphasis when he says he's stuck on the island with Ben.....however it could be more of a resentment of his current situation rather than resentment towards Ben. Sure, it's not the best thing to say to a 10 to 15 year old.....but Roger was drunk and things were hard for him.

Last scene when Ben's grown up with Roger. Roger seems respectful, says good morning to Ben. Seems ashamed that he's forgotten Ben's birthday yet again. Roger suggests how about they spend some Father & Son time at the Mesa to try and make up for forgetting Ben's birthday. Ben asks Roger if he blames him for his mother's death. Roger turns his head away as if almost saying "Nooooo, is that what you think?". Roger thinks for a moment, probably realizing now that Ben all this time thought Roger blamed him for his mother's death. Roger says "What do I know".......Roger is basically saying that he himself is stupid for making Ben feel like that. Then Roger asks why Ben's looking at his watch to break the tension, then offers to try and remember his birthday next year. Ben then tells Roger how he had to put up with him all these years.....and Roger just listens to it, not angry....maybe somewhat ashamed. Then Ben gases him. If Roger was a drunken abusing father, wouldn't he start getting angry with Ben? Wouldn't he be getting all defensive?

I don't see any evidence in this episode that Roger was a drunken abusing father figure, if you do....please point it out to me. I'm not saying that Roger made the best choices in his relationship with Ben, he did have a negative and sarcastic attitude (that wasn’t directed at Ben).....but I don't think he was a particularly bad father. I would wager to say, Roger was probably an average father.....it's just under the circumstances and how everything played out it turned unfortunate. Roger did drink beer a lot, but it didn't look like he had a substance abuse problem. He wasn't drunk when he was at work, looked like he only drank when he was stressed/depressed or to relax. I think a lot of Ben's issues with Roger is only in Ben's head, and Roger was not such a bad guy after all. Sure there were situations that Roger handled badly which may have caused emotional damage to Young Ben.....but Geez suck it up, Ben! What would have happened if Ben had Locke's dad for a dad?

You know I think the reason why I've went off on this rant for so long is because of how upset I am with Ben.....Ben kills his dad for stupid reasons. He genocides the people at the Dharma barracks.....who all have been nothing but nice to Ben from what we’ve seen. The Teacher (Olivia, Horace's Wife) was even acting sweet to young Ben during the hostile attack, telling Ben nicely he has to move. And what does Ben do to them when he grows up, he freaking kills them all. What a backstabber!

203
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Gun
« on: May 12, 2007, 08:10:33 PM »
How do you know it was a Beretta 9mm? It could have been a .40 Cal. Anyways it was a Beretta 92 or 94 that Alex gave Locke.

Locke had the Beretta before he went into the cabin tucked in the back of his pants, left side....he touches it with his left hand.

When Locke gets scared and runs out of the cabin, Locke gets to the door inside the cabin (to run out) we can see it looks like Locke no longer has the Beretta tucked in the back of his pants.

Just before Locke gets shot, he stands up and his back can be seen for a split second, he doesn't appear to have the Beretta.

Ben shoots Locke with a Beretta....appears to be the same one Alex gave Locke.

I'm guessing that Locke lost his Beretta in the cabin, and Ben picked it up. Apparrently Locke for some reason forgot he had a gun. Ben supoosedly had the Beretta in his side bag, as both his hands were near his bag before we see Ben holding a gun in his right hand. Oddly enough, Locke reaches for his knife instead of his Beretta.....maybe Locke thought he lost his gun.

204
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Purge
« on: May 12, 2007, 07:25:10 PM »
If the Purge is the gasing of the Dharma Barracks, I would say it happened after 1992.

Ben looked at his watch before he Gases his father, the watch is a Timex Indiglo Watch. It says so right on the watch.

Timex Indiglo watches was introduced in 1992 as per Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indiglo

So the purge must have occured in or after 1992. Strange that Ben has a Timex watch instead of a Dharma Logo watch, as Dharma likes putting their own logo on everything, including guns.

205
Episode 3x20 / Re: Why Jack?
« on: May 12, 2007, 07:13:14 PM »
I think it's going to be hard for Jack to be totally redeemed in my eyes......I've kind of given up on him from the frustration of his stupidness. For Jack to be redeemed to me, Jack's authority needs to be challenged by another Lostie. Then Jack resists and tries to maintain his authority. One of the Losties beats him up, and Jack's authority is publicly and totally stripped of him by the Losties. Then later on at some point Jack can come back and admit that he screwed up and accept that he was wrong. Only then can Jack be welcomed back into the Losties, but he has to present only smart ideas now.....and he has to share and work together with the Losties.....no more dictating to them.

This would make me like Jack again.....it has to be clear he screwed up, he admits it, suffer the consequences of it, and he's now making up for it and will try not to let it happen again by changing his ways.

No cheesy redemption like “Look I saved everybody, I should continue being the leader and not make any changes in the way I handle things”. This would not fly for me, it’ll be too much like Juliette’s faking to save Claire from the sickness. “Oh just because Juliette saved Claire from being sick, we can now trust her”. Bah, even if it was not a scam by the others, I would not trust Juliette still. (Funny thing is I actually kind of like Juliette, but she just lies way too much and doesn’t care about people. Did she ever even feel bad when Goodwyn died? She was shacked up with him if I recall correctly).

Jack's been wrong about a lot of things, and he's always acted like he's totally right at the time....and his way is the only way. And then after when he's wrong, he never admits it. Example: The Button. It pisses me off that he's like that time and time again. That's why I'm totally fed up with him. That arrogant jackass. =)

Do the Losties even need Jack anymore? Is there really a need for a spinal doctor when the Island heals people, and there’s no apparent real sickness?

206
Episode 3x20 / Re: Screencap/Investigations Request
« on: May 12, 2007, 06:27:57 PM »
When Ben and Roger first get to the Island via submarine, and Horace comes out to the dock to greet them, I noticed something hanging around his neck.  I couldn't tell if it was just a van key like the one Hurley found, or if it was something else, like the failsafe key.  Anyone have these screenshots?


It looks like a flat circular pendant....can't make out the markings on it. He was also wearing it at the beginning when Ben was born. It doesn't look like he's wearing it when he's talking to Ben's Father about the Natives. It's also not visible when we see his body after the gasing of the Dharma Barracks.

Side Note: Horace's Dharma Uniform says he's stationed at the Arrow.

207
Episode 3x20 / Re: The Others Are Mass Murderers
« on: May 12, 2007, 02:47:39 AM »
Maybe you've grown immune since I don't think Ben's dad deserved to die.  He was no where near as bad as other dads on the show.  He looks like Father of the Year compared to Locke or Sawyer's dad.  Especially when Ben kills him when his father is trying to make amends.
Yeah I totally agree with you, I don't think Ben's dad deserved it either. He didn't do anything bad to Ben other than hurt his feelings inadvertently.......Ben's dad never got over the death of his wife. When he made young Ben cry on his birthday, he was passed out drunk already......He probably wouldn't have been drinking all the time if his wife didn't die. Ben's dad didn't even attack Ben when he was gassed....just failing his arms around.

In this episode it seems the others are purely the Aggressors as they gassed the Dharma Barracks, and supposedly attacked during the School House scene. We also see that Ben's a pretty lowdown backstabber....kills his own father, goes along with killing all the Dharma personnel at the Barracks. From all his flashbacks, it seems like all the Dharma people were pretty nice to Ben.

208
Episode 3x20 / Re: Why Jack?
« on: May 12, 2007, 01:56:53 AM »
I first off want to say that I did like Jack, but he has just gotten way too stupid and incompetent to tolerate.

He brings Juliette back with him saying that she's now one of the Losties and can be trusted. She's not working for the other anymore.

All the Losties don't trust Juliette, and Jack keeps defending her.....saying that she's really not working for the others anymore. Juliette says the same, even though she really is still working for the other's. Juliette does her little scam with Claire's sickness, Sonigram's the Korean woman (Can't remember her name, not my favorite character). All under the guise of not working with the others anymore.

Sawyer, Sayid, other Losties all try and question Juliette....dumb Jack stops them...still thinking Juliette is on the Losties side.

So after the Sonigram, Juliette tells Jack "Guess what, I'm actually still working for the others afterall.....but I changed my mind now"

But does Jack think.....damn, the Losties were right all along.....how could I be so blind? How can I trust anything Juliette says now? NO, the big dummy thinks....."Oh I can trust Juliette NOW, because this time she's telling me the truth, unlike the last time when she told me she was telling me the truth but wasn't".

Then Jack shows up to the Losties' Meeting saying "Yeah Juliette told me she was still working for the others.....AFTER the sonigram. So the discovery of the Tape Recorder is meaningless, Juliette can be trusted now even though she tricked me when we both got back. Yeah I didn't tell you guys all this because I didn't think of a plan yet.....and being a brilliant leader, I was going to keep this to myself until I thought of a plan. Well since I don't have one yet, and you all found out.....lets talk".

ARGH! If I was one of the Losties, I would beat Jack senseless like how Locke beat Patchie. Then I would banish Jack just like how Hurley pretended they were going to banish Sawyer.

Jack.....Most Useless Leader on the Island ever! I still can't get over the fact that he lost all the Guns in the Hatch to the Others! AGRH Idiot!

Sorry I just had to get that out of my system. Who else agrees with me that Jack's gone way past his "term in office"?

209
Episode 3x20 / Re: who is the little girl
« on: May 12, 2007, 12:45:02 AM »
Annie is not Rousseau. Rousseau caught Ben in a net and was going to killing him.

I'm thinking Ben, being the cold hearted bastard he is for killing his own father & mass murdering the Dharma at the Barracks......Ben probably killed Annie himself before or after the purge. In the mass grave at the end of the episode we saw a Dharma body with what looks like a Gunshot hole in the skull above the left eye. I'm guessing that's Annie, who escaped the gas and Ben had to kill her afterwards.....or Annie found out what Ben was going to do before the gasing, and killed to her to maintain the plan. I'm thinking this will be shown in a future Ben flashback.....maybe when Ben deactivated the Sonic Barrier for the hostiles to get in, Annie followed him and found out. Ben then shot her.

210
Episode 3x20 / Re: Who is Jacob?
« on: May 12, 2007, 12:15:54 AM »
Somebody do a side-by-side of Jacob and Older Roger (Ben's Dad). It kind of looks like Older Roger when he's loading beer into the Van with Ben.

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