The Penguin
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Posts: 34
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« Reply #30 on: May 07, 2009, 07:33:35 PM » |
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You say heart, I say guilt.
I see Jack, a doctor, taking a greater burden by breaking his oath and forsaking a human life to save those Ben would kill. And kill he did. Lots.
Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts... |
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rhythm
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« Reply #31 on: May 07, 2009, 08:04:38 PM » |
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Some, however, can at times, put those things aside and think about the greater good. Jack did it. Sayid is doing it. Kate cannot, never could. She's an awful human being. I like the fact that the show has given us such a wide range of characters, but she's a bad seed. And she might do a lot more damage before the show is over.
Most of the characters on this show (& particularly the "main" characters): Jack, Locke, Sun, Jin, Sayid, Nikki & Paulo (sorry, couldn't resist), have all displayed selfish and slightly undesirable behavior. Jack: drug abuser, selfish, obsessive Locke: Manipulated Sawyer into killing his Anthony Cooper, killed Naomi, obsessive, drug manufacturer (marijuana) Sayid: torture, assassin Sun: affair Jin: henchman, lied about lineage Charlie: drug abuse Desmond: ex-convict Eko: crime lord, faux priest And I'm sure I'm forgetting far more. Point is Sawyer and more specifically Kate, are no worse than the others. |
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The guy masquerading as Locke? I'm officially calling him Bocaj. I don't care if anyone else is on board. Just know that when I use the name Bocaj, I'm speaking of the Anti-Jacob. Oh...I may call him that too. It's official, in my book he is Bocaj and/or AJ. You've been warned  |
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Mrs Alpert
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« Reply #32 on: May 07, 2009, 08:06:52 PM » |
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Mrs. Alpert,
You are hardcore Lost.
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jamesl
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« Reply #33 on: May 07, 2009, 09:29:53 PM » |
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Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts...
the women I know tell me that men think with their ... well, you know |
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Mrs Alpert
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« Reply #34 on: May 07, 2009, 09:31:06 PM » |
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Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts...
the women I know tell me that men think with their ... well, you know brains? |
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Mrs. Alpert,
You are hardcore Lost.
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hyperform
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« Reply #35 on: May 08, 2009, 12:38:01 AM » |
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Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts...
the women I know tell me that men think with their ... well, you know cargo shorts? |
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Mrs Alpert
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« Reply #36 on: May 08, 2009, 12:44:53 AM » |
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Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts...
the women I know tell me that men think with their ... well, you know cars? |
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Mrs. Alpert,
You are hardcore Lost.
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hyperform
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« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2009, 12:45:43 AM » |
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we should put like 50 guesses in here before morning
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Mrs Alpert
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« Reply #38 on: May 08, 2009, 12:53:00 AM » |
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we should put like 50 guesses in here before morning
Nah, you're falling asleep... I'll see what I can do in the meantime... |
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Logged
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Mrs. Alpert,
You are hardcore Lost.
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Mrs Alpert
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« Reply #39 on: May 08, 2009, 12:54:04 AM » |
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Maybe it's simply the difference between men and women. Generally (and, ladies, please don't kill me) men think with their heads, and women with their hearts...
the women I know tell me that men think with their ... well, you know sealed court records? |
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Logged
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Mrs. Alpert,
You are hardcore Lost.
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grizn0
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« Reply #40 on: May 08, 2009, 09:43:11 AM » |
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Kate is a runner and she is extremely selfish. She wouldn't sacrifice her free life to save everyone who died so far in the show. And she didn't want to sacrifice her realtionship with Jack. She got pissed at him because he wanted to do something that could potentially save Charlie, Boone, SHannon etc... but it would mean that her and Kate would never meet and Kate would go to jail.
OK, seriously - and maybe this makes me a horrible human being, but if I had been through 3 years that I didn't want to lose and was facing jail and was going to end up NOT meeting the man I love, I might be hesitant about saving the world too! Self-preservation is a very strong instinct. It doesn't make her a bad person. Are you forgetting that JACK wanted to let 12 year old Ben die?  ? BEFORE he became all evil and stuff? And that KATE was the one with a heart who wanted to save him? At that point I don't beieve Jack was "killing" young Ben by not operating on him. He was releasing control to the will of the island, his destiny. He is a believer in what Locke was trying to tell him way back when they blew the hatch open. |
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GUTZandRAGE
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« Reply #41 on: May 08, 2009, 10:02:32 AM » |
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As I've said before selfishness is part of human nature. But most of those characters have actually put it aside and made great sacrifices. Desmond for example was a selfish guy, he even left that poor girl at the altar and ran away to a monastery. But when it came time to die to save the day he went down there and turned the key. He couldn't have known he would survive. And you can't say, well, if he hadn't stopped pressing the button none of this would have happened, because he was alone in that hatch going insane.
Charlie did the same. And Charlie wasn't that bad, he just got screwed over by his horrible brother, who he tried to look after. But Liam was the one who hooked him on drugs and then left him holding the burden. He struggled with it, but in the end, he came through for everyone.
Eko was a bad man. But he made an honest effort to change, and in the end he accepted who he was, and he accepted death. He was rotten, but he admitted it to everyone and to himself.
John is crazy. He's just nuts. That dude scares me.
Jack is a hero. Like Superman or Green Lantern. Well, the old Green Lantern.
Sun and Jin are married. Stupid stupid people.
And Sayid killed a lot of people for Ben. Yes, for revenge, but also to protect the people left behind. And he shot Ben. You can see he is tired of killing and he doesn't want to do it. But he knew he had to try and stop things from happening how they did. That was his redemption and Kate stopped it cause she felt bad about abandoning Aaron so she could go back in time to bunker up with stupid Sawyer.
I just can't see anything Kate has done that is selfless. Except pulling that old man out of the truck. That was a very selfless thing to do, specially since she was being chased. But from the first episodes I hated they way she was. You could tell she was hoping the poor Marshall would die before waking up and spilling the beans about her.
I'll keep thinking it until she proves me wrong.
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I like to think of myself as a Jack/Desmond blend with a bit of Hurley and a twist of Miles.
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rhythm
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« Reply #42 on: May 09, 2009, 08:55:17 PM » |
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But Kate was on the run for killing her father. She killed her father because he was abusive. Some may or may not approve of that action. And one might say it was selfless because she thought she was protecting her mother. Subjective. (Remember, Kate was nice enough  to take out an insurance policy on the house so her mother would not only be rid of the dude that was beating the snot out of her but could get some financial gain out of it.) Each of the character has a "why" they are the way they are and reasons to excuse their behavior/actions. Kate is no different. I'm not saying that I believe the characters I mentioned before were necessarily bad, but others may. I know someone who would think less of Sun because she's an adultress than they would of Sawyer. Because in their minds, Sawyer may have been in an adulterous affair with women, but he wasn't married. Again, subjective. Now I'm not suggesting that Kate is perferct and beyond reproach. She has done some pretty sleazy things. Robbing banks, marrying someone even though she was on the lam, killing her father and the man her mother loved.... But as you mentioned, not everything she's done has been bad: she pulled the guy from the truck, she tried to give Cassie $ even though Sawyer didn't ask her to, she "saved" Locke from Smokie. And I'm sorry but I think she's wonderful for taking care of Aaron, regardless of what was her original motive. But I will admit, Kate was really getting on my nerves last episode. But I think that's because I believe what we've been seeing play out is what happend originally. So all I keep thinking is "quiet you twit, nothing he does is going to change the original out come. You'll still crash on the Island, escape, play house with Jack and Aaron, kick Jack out cause he's losing his marbles, get manipulated by Ben, and flash back to 1977- LET IT GO" |
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The guy masquerading as Locke? I'm officially calling him Bocaj. I don't care if anyone else is on board. Just know that when I use the name Bocaj, I'm speaking of the Anti-Jacob. Oh...I may call him that too. It's official, in my book he is Bocaj and/or AJ. You've been warned |
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LostinLock
Island Native
Offline
Posts: 30136
My Karma ran over your dogma.
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« Reply #43 on: May 13, 2009, 11:23:37 AM » |
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Nice twist if Juliette and Kate ended up together, for some folks it would be. Sawyer gets bumped off and they end up with each other. After all Smokey took their picture in it's minds eye. I rather think there would be an audience for a Kate and Juliette love interest. Though it would be nice for both Sawyer and Jack to be around when they see those two necking, then those guys would be  and saying women  I hope you all know I am having fun, but it is an idea |
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 I think now that LiL is back, all is right with the world. Before you begin on the journey of revenge, dig two graves. ~Proverb |
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Writers_Strike
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« Reply #44 on: May 13, 2009, 12:14:46 PM » |
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Nice twist if Juliette and Kate ended up together, for some folks it would be. Sawyer gets bumped off and they end up with each other. After all Smokey took their picture in it's minds eye. I rather think there would be an audience for a Kate and Juliette love interest. Though it would be nice for both Sawyer and Jack to be around when they see those two necking, then those guys would be and saying women I hope you all know I am having fun, but it is an idea I smell a ratings boost |
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