Author Topic: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)  (Read 7028 times)

Offline Harry Erickson

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Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« on: February 28, 2009, 09:33:54 AM »
I'm watching an old tv show the other day and a character says something that sparks a though, suicide is blasphemy or otherwise a sin, maybe thats why ben needed to kill locke instead of locke killing himself, lost has always had alot of religious stuff and maybe its something to do with that, i don't know just a thought or it was about the whole Ms Hawking thing

Offline WhatThe

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2009, 05:02:14 PM »
I still don't see how Locke mentioning Mrs. Hawking would be reason enough for Ben to kill Locke. Your suicide=sin concept makes more sense in my eyes.

Offline Bostonlost

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2009, 08:05:19 PM »
I still don't see how Locke mentioning Mrs. Hawking would be reason enough for Ben to kill Locke. Your suicide=sin concept makes more sense in my eyes.

I think you need to look at it as a whole...Take into account who told Locke about Hawkins Ben snaps because it is Jacob talking to Locke again....The Last time this happened Ben Shot Locke
« Last Edit: February 28, 2009, 08:39:13 PM by Bostonlost »

Offline Novashannon

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2009, 08:20:46 PM »
Ben is out only for Ben.  He killed Locke because he is jealous of him, and not for any greater good. 

Offline WhatThe

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2009, 08:45:14 PM »
I still don't see how Locke mentioning Mrs. Hawking would be reason enough for Ben to kill Locke. Your suicide=sin concept makes more sense in my eyes.

I think you need to look at it as a whole...Take into account who told Locke about Hawkins Ben snaps because it is Jacob talking to Locke again....The Last time this happened Ben Shot Locke

Actually, the last time "Jacob" talked to Locke Ben was with him and told Locke he needed to go into the cabin alone. He didn't attempt to kill Locke, or really do anything to him. He seemed to accept Locke's position in Jacob's eyes. I don't think Ben has an issue anymore with Locke interacting with Jacob, possibly because he knows the island is in danger in some way. Seeing Alex executed right in front of his eyes also probably put him into a different mindset about Widmore, the island, and Locke.

Offline Bostonlost

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2009, 09:38:33 PM »
I still don't see how Locke mentioning Mrs. Hawking would be reason enough for Ben to kill Locke. Your suicide=sin concept makes more sense in my eyes.

But Locke came out told him that the island had to be moved...cut all the way to Locke and Christian and we find out that again Ben was being deceitful with Locke and Jacob when he took it upon himself to move the Island.....

I don't see how you can not see hate and anger in Ben's eyes when he hears Locke say Hawkins

I think you need to look at it as a whole...Take into account who told Locke about Hawkins Ben snaps because it is Jacob talking to Locke again....The Last time this happened Ben Shot Locke

Actually, the last time "Jacob" talked to Locke Ben was with him and told Locke he needed to go into the cabin alone. He didn't attempt to kill Locke, or really do anything to him. He seemed to accept Locke's position in Jacob's eyes. I don't think Ben has an issue anymore with Locke interacting with Jacob, possibly because he knows the island is in danger in some way. Seeing Alex executed right in front of his eyes also probably put him into a different mindset about Widmore, the island, and Locke.

Offline LostinLock

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2009, 09:47:41 PM »
I'm watching an old tv show the other day and a character says something that sparks a though, suicide is blasphemy or otherwise a sin, maybe thats why ben needed to kill locke instead of locke killing himself, lost has always had alot of religious stuff and maybe its something to do with that, i don't know just a thought or it was about the whole Ms Hawking thing

Not an expert but in some faiths, it is a sin.

I believe that the writers are using the religious symbols to tell a story.  I hope for all intent purposes of this show that they have not taken this to a level of the second coming of Christ, as this would be jumping the shark.

There are many analogies one can look at but I think they have been over analyzed. :-\

Ben killed John, second time around, because Ben is Ben and has his own motives.  Good or Bad Ben did not do this to save the Locke from shame of suicide.  And Mrs. Hawkings in a what resemembled a Catholic Church, blessed Virgin in the background, did not appear to have an issue.

The church is background, a location, quite a good one for people coming in and out without suspicion.  Perhaps a neutral territory.  Smart idea to build a church over the lampost.

I am sure in Ben's mind he is thinking well Jack or whomever you got crack a few eggs to make a good omlet ;D

Offline Sweet Old Lady

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2009, 11:27:59 PM »
I wonder if Ben will get a mark like Juliet did when she killed Pickett.

Offline LouE68

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2009, 01:18:35 AM »
I wonder if Ben will get a mark like Juliet did when she killed Pickett.
speaking of that...we need to see them too...are they in the group moving around somewhere too

Offline userh6478

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2009, 06:38:59 PM »
Why would Ben Kill Locke just to bring him to the island with him..He apparently wasn't too threatened by him..He knew he was going to reseccureted..by the story he told in the church

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2009, 12:09:18 AM »
That was what I was thinking too. (see below from a post last week, I didn't feel like rewriting it. over and over and over)

I feel that if Locke killed himself then the island wont take him back. it might make him a sinner. like the catholics believed you wouldn't go to heaven if you killed yourself. Ben had to do it. or it wouldn't be a crucifix. God didn't commit suicide he was hung. !!!!  My feeling is that Ben is and has always done what he needed to do for the island. Ben= good.  :o We just don't know it yet.

 * add - ( Jesus,  God,  you know )

Also,
looked to me like Cesar knew what he was looking for. they (him and the marshall) obviously work for widmore along with sayid now. at least that is what I think after this episode as of right now.


and Something tells me if the island didn't want Ben to kill Locke, then Ben wouldn't have succeeded. just like all the other times Ben tried. (maybe Ben didn't try to kill him but it was either a test or just to slow him down)

 If Ben wanted to kill Locke for his own purposes then he wouldn't have brought him back to the island knowing that he was going to be resurrected. (we know he knew because of the story he told Jack in the church) and if he didn't know until later then how dumb is he since locke told him he had to bring everyone back.

 I also think that Ben isn't really that hurt, and he is doing another "Henry gale".


Offline TheBrightandTheDark

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2009, 12:46:12 AM »
Mrs H, I'm going to have to use that in casual conversation now..."Oh, he's not hurt, he's just pulling a Henry Gale..." LOL! Love it.

Offline LouE68

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2009, 02:01:53 AM »
I still trust Ben...I think he stopped Locke from killing himself a major sin, he knew Locke had to die, so he did the dirty work....The writers are sure being trixie....it's all so crazy...

Offline Holland34

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2009, 02:39:36 AM »
While I think your end-thought may be on-target, I think your reasoning is incorrect.  I won't speak for all religions, but since the majority of the religious overtones in Lost have been around Christianity, I will say that generally accepted theology does not accept that suicide is a sin.  Without getting into a major debate on that, I will point to the concept of what you were getting at (or what I think you were getting at)... Richard Alpert said John had to die to get the others back.  However, Locke killing himself would not have accomplished that in and of itself.  Ben had to take over the drive to recruit the O6.  So mysterious forces (read: the island) put him in a position to take on that role... part of his selling pitch was Locke's death... thus making Alpert's statement true.

Offline Thomas

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Re: Suicide is a Sin (Reason for Ben Killing)
« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2009, 08:58:50 AM »
It seems to me that Ben kills Locke because Ben is selfish/Jealous.    Jacob tells Locke to move the island, but Ben does it instead.    Richard tells Locke to bring back the others, and that he would have to die.   Ben ends up Killing Locke and getting the others to come back.    Ben's actions seem to be a message to Jacob/Richard and company that they are wasting their time with Locke.   Locke can't do anything on his own...Ben wants to convince them of this and be the Leader.