Author Topic: 316: Question of the Week  (Read 10445 times)

Offline CastawayCayley

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #30 on: February 23, 2009, 11:04:39 AM »
This may fit more into a discussion or opinion piece, but I'm curious to know what you think, Sledge, about the differences between the time jumping that killed Minkowski and the time jumping that killed Charlotte (if any).
i second this.

The difference between these two types of time jumps were that in Minkowski (and Desmond's) case, their mind and consciousness were only jumping through time; their bodies would stay in each time zone and they would appear to just "zone out" for however long their time jump lasted, and then return. In Charlotte's (and the rest of the Losties on the island after Ben moved the wheel in the Orchid station) case, not just their mind and consciousness was time jumping, but their entire bodies were going through time. This gave the appearance of them disappearing (as we were told by Danielle Russeau when she accused Jin of being sick because he "disappeared").

In Minkowski's circumstance, a "constant" is needed to connect your mind with the past and the present (A constant defined by Daniel Faraday as: "something that you really care about, or something that is familiar to you in both times). In this type of time jump, the brain starts to hemorrhage in the same amount of time for every person; there is no variable. Without a "constant," the brain hemorrhage will inevitably cause death.

In Charlotte's circumstance, a "constant" cannot be acquired because your mind isn't being split through time; your mind is staying with your body, which in essence, causes what Daniel Faraday calls "really bad jet lag." The brain starts to hemorrhage quicker depending upon how long you have been on the island in the past; there is a variable, which is duration of exposure to the island. The longer you have been on the island within your lifetime, the sooner your brain starts to hemorrhage. We have not been told, yet, if there is any way to stop the hemorrhaging from happening during this type of time jump. If the "flashes" through time continue to happen, you will inevitably die.

I'm glad I asked this question. This is exactly what I already thought, and had actually written in answer in a thread about 3 minutes before I posted this question here, but because I wanted Sledge's take (and possible confirmation) to clear up what I was seeing as a lot of confusion, I thought I'd add it here for Sledge to discuss/answer. But the responses I've gotten on this thread show me that more people are thinking the way I do, which is always a plus. ;)

But for those people that are still confused I thought it might be interesting to get an "official" take from Sledge himself.  I see a lot of interesting questions being posed. We have a really smart group of users!!

Offline Ladybug

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #31 on: February 23, 2009, 11:23:14 AM »
This may fit more into a discussion or opinion piece, but I'm curious to know what you think, Sledge, about the differences between the time jumping that killed Minkowski and the time jumping that killed Charlotte (if any).
i second this.

The difference between these two types of time jumps were that in Minkowski (and Desmond's) case, their mind and consciousness were only jumping through time; their bodies would stay in each time zone and they would appear to just "zone out" for however long their time jump lasted, and then return. In Charlotte's (and the rest of the Losties on the island after Ben moved the wheel in the Orchid station) case, not just their mind and consciousness was time jumping, but their entire bodies were going through time. This gave the appearance of them disappearing (as we were told by Danielle Russeau when she accused Jin of being sick because he "disappeared").

In Minkowski's circumstance, a "constant" is needed to connect your mind with the past and the present (A constant defined by Daniel Faraday as: "something that you really care about, or something that is familiar to you in both times). In this type of time jump, the brain starts to hemorrhage in the same amount of time for every person; there is no variable. Without a "constant," the brain hemorrhage will inevitably cause death.

In Charlotte's circumstance, a "constant" cannot be acquired because your mind isn't being split through time; your mind is staying with your body, which in essence, causes what Daniel Faraday calls "really bad jet lag." The brain starts to hemorrhage quicker depending upon how long you have been on the island in the past; there is a variable, which is duration of exposure to the island. The longer you have been on the island within your lifetime, the sooner your brain starts to hemorrhage. We have not been told, yet, if there is any way to stop the hemorrhaging from happening during this type of time jump. If the "flashes" through time continue to happen, you will inevitably die.

I'm glad I asked this question. This is exactly what I already thought, and had actually written in answer in a thread about 3 minutes before I posted this question here, but because I wanted Sledge's take (and possible confirmation) to clear up what I was seeing as a lot of confusion, I thought I'd add it here for Sledge to discuss/answer. But the responses I've gotten on this thread show me that more people are thinking the way I do, which is always a plus. ;)

But for those people that are still confused I thought it might be interesting to get an "official" take from Sledge himself.  I see a lot of interesting questions being posed. We have a really smart group of users!!
i too, was wanting to see sledge's take on the issue.  but patrixmith, thanks for your answer!  very well written and understandable.  i like the way you put things.

Offline patrixmith

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #32 on: February 23, 2009, 01:23:33 PM »
Ladybug, your user pic and signature is cracking me up. Haha.

Offline Ladybug

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #33 on: February 23, 2009, 01:40:30 PM »
Ladybug, your user pic and signature is cracking me up. Haha.
i aim to please!

Offline Bostonlost

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #34 on: February 23, 2009, 04:52:29 PM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Offline patrixmith

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #35 on: February 23, 2009, 06:43:17 PM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Charles Widmore knew the location of the island and was getting "too close" for Ben's comfort. The island had to be moved to get away from Widmore.

Offline JBRam

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #36 on: February 23, 2009, 08:39:37 PM »
A question I have.... Why do they need to re-create the scene as much as possible? Dont they just have to be there in the plane? Why bother with dead mans shoes and guitar cases??
What exactly does this have to do with them getting back to the island. If they re just on the plane and the plane is set to fly through one of these windows surely that would be enough.
What are they trying to trick by substituting people for objects?
Explanations??
In addition, is there an importance to Hurley's buying most of the plane? I'd think it would be more accurate if the plane was as full as Oceanic's Flight 815.

Offline The_Hatch_Monkey

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #37 on: February 23, 2009, 08:51:03 PM »
A question I have.... Why do they need to re-create the scene as much as possible? Dont they just have to be there in the plane? Why bother with dead mans shoes and guitar cases??
What exactly does this have to do with them getting back to the island. If they re just on the plane and the plane is set to fly through one of these windows surely that would be enough.
What are they trying to trick by substituting people for objects?
Explanations??
In addition, is there an importance to Hurley's buying most of the plane? I'd think it would be more accurate if the plane was as full as Oceanic's Flight 815.

I think Hurley is concerned about saving lives---he doesn't want innocent people to be in a plane crash--Hurley has caused enough problems by the 'cursed numbers'--I don't think he wants to add to that guilt.

Offline CastawayCayley

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #38 on: February 23, 2009, 11:39:59 PM »
A question I have.... Why do they need to re-create the scene as much as possible? Dont they just have to be there in the plane? Why bother with dead mans shoes and guitar cases??
What exactly does this have to do with them getting back to the island. If they re just on the plane and the plane is set to fly through one of these windows surely that would be enough.
What are they trying to trick by substituting people for objects?
Explanations??
In addition, is there an importance to Hurley's buying most of the plane? I'd think it would be more accurate if the plane was as full as Oceanic's Flight 815.

I think Hurley is concerned about saving lives---he doesn't want innocent people to be in a plane crash--Hurley has caused enough problems by the 'cursed numbers'--I don't think he wants to add to that guilt.

I agree with Hatch Monkey. He cares. He doesn't want innocent lives on that flight. He may not have gotten the message about having to "recreate the flight", he just might have gotten the message to be on 316 and he'd get back. Period. Also, I believe that there will not be a guitar in that case. He's the comic relief on the show, it has to be something silly in there.

Offline jamesl

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #39 on: February 23, 2009, 11:47:02 PM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Charles Widmore knew the location of the island and was getting "too close" for Ben's comfort. The island had to be moved to get away from Widmore.

right, but Mrs Hawking implied that the island is ALWAYS moving
at least that's what I got from her little speech, (because she said the pendulum tells us where the island is "going to be" so it sounds as if its ALWAYS moving) and I think that's what Bostonlost is thinking too
so if the Island is always moving, how did Widmore come close to finding it ? and why would Ben have to move it, if its always moving ?
I think that's what Bostonlost is asking ?




Offline CastawayCayley

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #40 on: February 23, 2009, 11:47:13 PM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Our Mutual Friend (how's that for a Lost reference!!) and I talked about that at my Lost Party, and it's a fantastic question! Why would Ben need to move the island? They were supposedly threatened by Widmore's team but now we know that Widmore has been on the island and knows about it's "specialness"... why would they need to move it to hide from him? The more we see this season the more we assume Widmore knows, in which case, moving the island seems a bit moot. Additionally it has been, apparently, "always moving"? So, who exactly are we hiding the island from?

Offline TheBrightandTheDark

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #41 on: February 24, 2009, 12:04:51 AM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Our Mutual Friend (how's that for a Lost reference!!) and I talked about that at my Lost Party, and it's a fantastic question! Why would Ben need to move the island? They were supposedly threatened by Widmore's team but now we know that Widmore has been on the island and knows about it's "specialness"... why would they need to move it to hide from him? The more we see this season the more we assume Widmore knows, in which case, moving the island seems a bit moot. Additionally it has been, apparently, "always moving"? So, who exactly are we hiding the island from?

I had always thought that Ben's turning the wheel moved the island in time, and if the island is always moving, if it changes time, it changes location. So Widmore wouldn't be able to find it.

Offline The_Hatch_Monkey

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #42 on: February 24, 2009, 12:56:58 AM »
I don't know if if this question has been ask but If Ben had to move the Island then why? If the Island is always moving?

Our Mutual Friend (how's that for a Lost reference!!) and I talked about that at my Lost Party, and it's a fantastic question! Why would Ben need to move the island? They were supposedly threatened by Widmore's team but now we know that Widmore has been on the island and knows about it's "specialness"... why would they need to move it to hide from him? The more we see this season the more we assume Widmore knows, in which case, moving the island seems a bit moot. Additionally it has been, apparently, "always moving"? So, who exactly are we hiding the island from?

We know that Daniel has a connection to Widmore (and specifically that he funded Dan's research)--and even though it seems like Ben and Eloise are in league together---I would venture a guess that Widmore knows how to track the movement of the island (If he isn't an alliance with Eloise or Daniel...I would think he used to be).  Even though the island is always moving--that doesn't mean Widmore doesn't have some idea of where it is going to be at certain times.  I think it is when Widmore is pinning down and exact location, THAT is when Ben needs to move the island to a location that is not being tracked.  I think that when Ben moves the island, it throws Widmore off...and he has to start all over in tracking the island.

I could be way off the mark, but that's my two cents worth.

Offline patrixmith

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #43 on: February 24, 2009, 01:07:58 PM »
Here's a wild theory-

When Keamey goes into the safe in the freighter to get the 2nd protocol folder containing information on where Ben is going and what he is doing, the captain of the boat asks him "How could Widmore possibly know that?" To which Keamey replies, "Because Charles Widmore is a very smart man."

And, in the lamppost station, Ms. Hawking tells us that a very smart man built the pendulum and designed the series of equations that approximates the location of the island.

Could Charles Widmore have built the pendulum, or, at the least, financed the construction of the pendulum giving him access to its information and approximations? That would more than justify his reasons for being able to locate the island and park his freighter 5 miles off its coastline in the first place. What do you all think?

Offline MachThree

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Re: 316: Question of the Week
« Reply #44 on: February 24, 2009, 01:29:36 PM »
I think the Island is always moving, on a predictable path that can be measured/calculated/derived using the technique employed at the Lamp Post station.  It might take quite a long time to calculate its path (Ben moved the donkey wheel about 3 years ago), so if Ms. Hawking has just relocated it, that implies it takes a long time, and implies why moving the Island would give it a temporary respite from Widmore.  And I think that moving the donkey wheel just changes the path in some way, the net result of which is that if anyone thinks they've located the island or can predict its location, they've got to start their calculations over.