Author Topic: Locke not Knowing Richard  (Read 12237 times)

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #60 on: January 26, 2009, 08:13:20 PM »
could You  make it with lots of rhinestones pls?!  ;D 

Offline DIZZYBECKSTER

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #61 on: January 26, 2009, 08:14:49 PM »
you betcha - as sparkly as the twinkle in a timeshifting-losties eye

Offline Alex2000

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #62 on: January 26, 2009, 08:48:38 PM »
I dont get how you all dismissed the theory that Richard is a time traveller too... It makes sense... and understandable for Mrs & Mrs Casual Viewer also. He hasn't aged. Thats because in Richard's eyes all the events probably took place in a 12 month period or something. He jumped back in time to find Locke as a baby, to test him, and all the times he's appeared to him on island. Richard interacts with all other charcters too - but obviously has a connection with Locke hence being there at key times, planting seeds or ideas, guiding him through.

And probably been mentioned elsewhere but has to post somewhere..... i have a theory on the whispers... it's the voices of timeshifted people, not quite in the right time...

chew on those then...

Not really dismissing it. I just think it is unlikely. I just find it hard to believe there is some time machine somewhere on the island that Richard gets into, and hops around time in. It is just too... too cliché. But it is possible I suppose (but I would be disappointed - lazy writing)

 I just think it makes a lot more sense, and it is more fitting in keeping with the ambitious LOST storytelling that Richard, and other island "natives", just age a lot more slowly than people off the island... somehow.

Speculation as to why? Well it might not be that Richard and the other "others" are superhumans or something. But just that for them, and other island "natives" time moves differently, so that they appear to never age.


sorry - did you say there is no time machine?? what about Bunny 15?

So? What about him? We all know Dharma was experimenting with the special properties of the island. We also know that The Orchid Station, and it's rabbits, were involved with experimentation with time and some sort of time travel travel.

But I think it is a huge leap to assume that just because Dharma was doing experiments in that area, that therefore the "others" have a complete working time machine hidden somewhere. I still think it is unlikely.


Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #63 on: January 26, 2009, 10:07:58 PM »
well,wait a miniute....  it's obvious Dharma didn't build that wheel in the rocks now, so who did?!  the others maybe?! and I'm sure they weren't experimenting since it worked. so why is that so hard to believe Richard would be all knowing and able to time travel if the others knew more about it and actually built something to make the whole island or at least a lot of people on the island to be able to skip in time so the island can't be found? Probably one of the main reasons for Dharma to come to that island to experiment in the first place. I'm thinking it's not that far fetched .

Offline DIZZYBECKSTER

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #64 on: January 27, 2009, 12:53:27 PM »
;) yeah.. what she said

Offline MangoBingo

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #65 on: January 27, 2009, 04:42:05 PM »
I dont get how you all dismissed the theory that Richard is a time traveller too...

The first reply to this thread was mine... and I said that Richard may have travelled back from the future.

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #66 on: January 27, 2009, 04:46:18 PM »
Dizzy said that because in the last pages of the thread ppl were starting to say richard wasn't time traveling. 

Offline Alex2000

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #67 on: January 27, 2009, 05:14:56 PM »
except that all the foreshadowing around dharma and time manipulation (the rabbits etc) were related to Dharma's Orchid station. Thats where they were doing their research, and that was the focus of our speculation. We found out what was there. It wasn't a traditional Doctor Who time machine. It was the wheel, which does seem to manipulate time somehow in order to move the island. If we were going to come across a Lost version of the TARDAS, wouldn't it have been logical to find it at the Orchid station after all that foreshadowing? I think we have found the island's "time manipulation device" - The wheel. I find it hard to believe that we are going to stumble across another room down there under the Orchid with a Tardas police box in it.

But you might say "it might be somewhere else". But all the time related foreshadowing has revolved around the Orchid. For them to go now "well over here is another time manipulation spot you have never heard of in the past 4 seasons" would just be disappointing writing.

And again, I think an actual time machine is just so cliché, and a frankly lazy deus ex machina cop-out for the writers that I can't believe one of the best written shows on TV would resort to it. Plus, we have had the build up about the orchid station , and the big reveal (the wheel at the end of season 4) and the fallout - the havoc it has brought to the island. At this point I think it would seem strange to double back down the time-road, instead of coming up with a fresh, less obvious explanation.

No, I have faith that the writers and going to answer the Richard-never-ages question with a more surprising, less direct, more thought provoking answer.

just my 2 cents.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2009, 05:21:31 PM by Alex2000 »

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #68 on: January 27, 2009, 05:39:08 PM »
except that all the foreshadowing around dharma and time manipulation (the rabbits etc) were related to Dharma's Orchid station. Thats where they were doing their research, and that was the focus of our speculation. We found out what was there. It wasn't a traditional Doctor Who time machine. It was the wheel, which does seem to manipulate time somehow in order to move the island. If we were going to come across a Lost version of the TARDAS, wouldn't it have been logical to find it at the Orchid station after all that foreshadowing? I think we have found the island's "time manipulation device" - The wheel. I find it hard to believe that we are going to stumble across another room down there under the Orchid with a Tardas police box in it.

But you might say "it might be somewhere else". But all the time related foreshadowing has revolved around the Orchid. For them to go now "well over here is another time manipulation spot you have never heard of in the past 4 seasons" would just be disappointing writing.

And again, I think an actual time machine is just so cliché, and a frankly lazy deus ex machina cop-out for the writers that I can't believe one of the best written shows on TV would resort to it. Plus, we have had the build up about the orchid station , and the big reveal (the wheel at the end of season 4) and the fallout - the havoc it has brought to the island. At this point I think it would seem strange to double back down the time-road, instead of coming up with a fresh, less obvious explanation.

No, I have faith that the writers and going to answer the Richard-never-ages question with a more surprising, less direct, more thought provoking answer
just my 2 cents.

I don't think , when we say ,(well at least when I say )that I think Richard time travels, I don't envision him getting in a little box/car like object with flashing lights and buttons all over strapping himself in and counting down till take off!  but they sure do know a lot about time travel  considering they never did it before! you don't think that Mrs Hawking could have told Ben  to send Richard to see john on so and so day, so and so  time ,and he only has this much time before he goes back?  ( I would never say I'm positive about anything that i don't have 100% proof of)  I'm not swearing on it but I just believe it is possible.  Would I be open for a better explanation , heck yeah ,sure why not?

Offline jugdish

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #69 on: January 27, 2009, 07:24:51 PM »
Ben learned all about the island from the Others. Dharma was not using the donkey wheel, just the properties around the area. The Others appear to have all the knowledge about the island. So anything is possible with Richard and time travel.

(that is why I was hoping against time travel the whole time!!)

Offline PrincessLeia

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #70 on: January 27, 2009, 07:25:40 PM »
I don't see the wheel itself as THE means by which time travel is possible.  From the Orchid orientation film- "The unique properties of this island have created a kind of Casimir effect, allowing the DHARMA initiative to conduct unique experiments in both space and time.

This is the vault, constructed adjacent to a pocket of what we believe to be negatively charged "exotic matter". Great care must be taken to avoid leaving inorganic materials inside the chamber. The electromagnetic energy within the Island can be highly volatile and unpredictable."

The entire Island holds the unique properties, & I would think that the natives would understand how to utilize them.  "Only fools are enslaved in time & space" seems to indicate that the Others do have the ability to jump around somehow (Harper, Walt, Richard, etc.).  Turning the wheel wasn't necessary until the entire Island needed to be dislodged from the timeline.





crap- Juggy posted his while I was typing. lol

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #71 on: January 28, 2009, 12:58:38 PM »
lol, don't you hate when that happeneds!  :D especially when you are saying the same thing.

thanks, you guys put it more eloquently than i did but pretty much we are on the same page.

Offline Alex2000

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #72 on: January 28, 2009, 11:57:44 PM »
ho ho ho!!

Vindication! You see 5x03 - Jughead? Sorry, but I just had to post here to gloat a little.

Juliet said Richard was "very old". And all that we learned fit in perfectly with what I posted before:

1) Locke is timeshifted back to the early 50s. (It might have already happened. Don't you think that the uniforms and weapons of the soldiers that Juliet, Sawyer and finally Locke were fighting looked like they were WW2 era?). Locke tells Richard to help him in the (very) distant future with his wound.

2) Locke meets Richard for the "first" time (keeping in mind that Richard doesn't age). Using the compass to prove who he is (somehow).
   Richard visits Locke as a baby in 1956 then again as a child in 1961 where the compass is one of the items shown to him.

3) Locke and the 815ers are time skipped.[Pre-Oceanic 815 Crash, but Post-Dharma genocide and Ben's takeover]Sawyer and the 815ers leave the beach where their camp will be in the future. Locke sees the drug plane (with Eko's brother on it) crash into the island. He goes to the crash site. Locke appears before Ethan (who doesn't know Locke yet) who then confronts him. Ethan would obviously tell Richard about this encounter (confirming what Locke told Richard in the "past").

4) Oceanic 815 Crashes, events of season 1 to 4 take place, Locke takes over the others. 

5) Ben turns wheel, things go nuts, Richard watches the crashed plane site for the "foretold" appearance of the wounded Locke.


Come on, I was bang on. Someone show me some love.  ;D

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #73 on: January 29, 2009, 03:22:45 AM »
lol, I thought about this convo when she said that too! So you got much props!
BUT, I'm still not too sure of the timeline.( or the one that is in the link above). (I'll explain) also, when you said Richard would go back in time and do the test I couldn't see that happening but I could see him doing it this way now. now I see, it wasn't Richard going back in time. it just didn't happen yet. and it was Locke going to the past! amazing tptb are! but I'm confused now. cause now it seems like time is in a loop. Locke is the chosen one now, because Locke told Richard he is in the past?! but then how did he become the chosen one before he told Richard he was. ugh.   ???

http://lost.cubit.net/forum/index.php?topic=8393.msg491834#msg491834
and then I have mine.......which I'll post after this... and you will see why I say this.

(I just realized your timeline and the one i was talking about were two totally different  "timeline subjects" but you could tell me what you think of it anyway  :-\ )
« Last Edit: January 29, 2009, 03:39:49 AM by Mrs Hume »

Offline Mrs Hume

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Re: Locke not Knowing Richard
« Reply #74 on: January 29, 2009, 03:32:10 AM »
(this is a post I posted in another thread)

OK, this got me second guessing myself. So I went back and watched it again, which I do anyway before I watch the next new one, and I know it's hard enough to figure out the things we haven't got the facts for but it's even harder when you don't have the facts that we do have right. So this is the facts that we have now...

1) 3 yrs ago, the first flash, when the island is moved. John See's the plane crash. Ethan shoots John. (proof it's the past ) The beach camp is gone.  So it's pre 815 crash. PAST.

2) Next flash , the Hatch is already blown up. the Beachcraft is on the ground. All we know is that it's after the 815 crash..... BUT.....  If it was in the future , the o6 still didn't come back to the island yet, John still has to visit the o6 off the island like Richard said himself , and he still didn't die after trying to recruit the o6 to come back. in the future he is Dead off the island. And the time jumps are still happening. SO, that leads me to believe this is still the PAST.
Revised and biggest reason I think the above link is wrong about #2 is that the statues that the cocaine was in that charlie was using, were still in the beachcraft. If it was after or way after they found it, charlie and Locke would have taken all the statues out of it.Btwn charlie using and hidding most of them and Locke doing whatever he did with them, there was none left in the beachcraft . so it had to be way way before charlie died.
 
3) Beach craft is back up on the slope. The Hatch is there (but still covered) Desmond is still in Hatch. Beach camp not there yet. So pre 815 crash. PAST


I didn't look up the dates to go with all this like the link above but I think I'm right about #2 being in the past and not the future. Does anyone agree?
« Last Edit: January 29, 2009, 03:40:46 AM by Mrs Hume »