Author Topic: "Well, obviously we're not dead"  (Read 2967 times)

Offline KateReallyLovesJack

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"Well, obviously we're not dead"
« on: June 03, 2007, 10:07:20 PM »
So Naomi swoops in on the island from her unseen parachute where she jumped from an unseen helicopter which took off from a freighter 80 miles away - all sounds pretty suspect to begin with right? (Yes, I know they get a hold of 'Minkowski' on her satelite phone but he could be anywhere, true?)
But then she tosses in this information that their plane was found, bodies inside, in an ocean trench - memorials were held, new albums were released, blah blah blah.
Why do they believe her?

Offline toadsage

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #1 on: June 04, 2007, 12:30:01 AM »
i think they belive her becuase, after all that they've been through the prospect of rescue is to great to pass up. they've been there what 90 somthing days? id probably belive her too. id belive just about anything too, if it meant id get to leave x-files island.

Offline Maxor127

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #2 on: June 04, 2007, 03:31:31 AM »
Because there must be a freighter or ship of some sort nearby for her to fly there from a helicopter.  I think things we can believe is that she was in a helicopter and she did take off from a freighter nearby.

Offline WhatThe

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #3 on: June 04, 2007, 12:33:33 PM »
As well as because she had a life-threatening injury that required a needle to be plunged into her lung in order to survive. That's a pretty drastic set up to fool the Losties if she's not telling the truth.

As well as Ben and Locke didn't want contact made to her ship, with Locke going so far as to kill her. Everytime Locke has done something drastic like that, it's been to keep rescue from arriving. Fits in with what Naomi has been telling everyone.


Offline Chefpyro

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2007, 12:56:06 PM »
and now Jack regrets leaving the island. he should've listened to Locke.

Offline jugdish

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2007, 01:00:57 PM »
You have to believe in something, It is about having hope!

Offline WhatThe

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2007, 01:34:32 PM »
and now Jack regrets leaving the island. he should've listened to Locke.

Locke should have been more specific, too lol...On this show, however, it's WAY too much to ask someone to just simply say "Listen, here's why you're not supposed to call the boat, here's what will happen, and why, etc, etc."...Nah, better that we just throw knives in people's backs or konk them on the head while trying to "triangulate a signal" lol :)

Offline CurtYanko

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2007, 01:40:23 PM »
So Naomi swoops in on the island from her unseen parachute where she jumped from an unseen helicopter which took off from a freighter 80 miles away - all sounds pretty suspect to begin with right? (Yes, I know they get a hold of 'Minkowski' on her satelite phone but he could be anywhere, true?)
But then she tosses in this information that their plane was found, bodies inside, in an ocean trench - memorials were held, new albums were released, blah blah blah.
Why do they believe her?


The official podcast tells us that either she was lying or there is a conspiracy and I for one think it may be both. There was a conspiracy to cover up the planes disappearance and obviously Naomi's story was a cover. So... how much did she really know? Was she really coming for Desmond? ...I doubt it.

We have to ask ourselves, what was her mission objective? I would guess it was simply to locate the island and then let the cavalry know. She even made sure someone else knew how to operate the phone in case something happened to her. So now we ask, who's cavalry? Is it the return of Dharma trying to reclaim the island or some other group?

Offline LostAndSeek

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2007, 02:42:15 PM »
and now Jack regrets leaving the island. he should've listened to Locke.

Locke should have been more specific, too lol...On this show, however, it's WAY too much to ask someone to just simply say "Listen, here's why you're not supposed to call the boat, here's what will happen, and why, etc, etc."...Nah, better that we just throw knives in people's backs or konk them on the head while trying to "triangulate a signal" lol :)

I don't reckon Locke knows the specifics. He's going mostly on faith.

Offline KateReallyLovesJack

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2007, 05:04:01 PM »
Alright Jug, I agree that it's about having hope - but I still just don't get it. Aren't they the least bit suspicious? About the fact that somebody back home wants them gone? Obviously, something is wrong here - who is trying to convince the world that the plane was found in the ocean? And that the bodies were found?

I can't even get this out straight, it's all jumbled up in my head... lol  ???

They're not dead, the plane is with them on the island, so they know somebody is lying about them, why are they so quick to trust Naomi? The fact that she could be in on that lie doesn't even cross their mind... they just call her boat...

Offline LostAndSeek

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2007, 05:39:04 PM »
Alright Jug, I agree that it's about having hope - but I still just don't get it. Aren't they the least bit suspicious? About the fact that somebody back home wants them gone? Obviously, something is wrong here - who is trying to convince the world that the plane was found in the ocean? And that the bodies were found?

I can't even get this out straight, it's all jumbled up in my head... lol  ???

They're not dead, the plane is with them on the island, so they know somebody is lying about them, why are they so quick to trust Naomi? The fact that she could be in on that lie doesn't even cross their mind... they just call her boat...

Sayid was very suspicious, but became less so as she had believable and detailed answers to his questions.

Offline jec9000

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2007, 07:48:06 PM »
So Naomi swoops in on the island from her unseen parachute where she jumped from an unseen helicopter which took off from a freighter 80 miles away - all sounds pretty suspect to begin with right? (Yes, I know they get a hold of 'Minkowski' on her satelite phone but he could be anywhere, true?)
But then she tosses in this information that their plane was found, bodies inside, in an ocean trench - memorials were held, new albums were released, blah blah blah.
Why do they believe her?


The official podcast tells us that either she was lying or there is a conspiracy and I for one think it may be both. There was a conspiracy to cover up the planes disappearance and obviously Naomi's story was a cover. So... how much did she really know? Was she really coming for Desmond? ...I doubt it.

We have to ask ourselves, what was her mission objective? I would guess it was simply to locate the island and then let the cavalry know. She even made sure someone else knew how to operate the phone in case something happened to her. So now we ask, who's cavalry? Is it the return of Dharma trying to reclaim the island or some other group?

I tend to agree with your thinking, but what I keep coming back to.....

If her mission objective was simply to locate the island and then radio its position back to her superiors, why even bother to make up such a complicated story about 815?  And why even bring up Desmond and Penny? As far as the losties know she IS looking for them and they would swallow that story hook, line and sinker with few questions. Why bother to tell them otherwise with some convoluted and strange story about the plane being found with all passengers dead? Wouldn't that just invite suspicion about her motives just from the sheer weirdness of it?

And if the Others found her first, why have any type of identifying objects with her at all, ie the picture of Desmond and its inherent Widmore connection.   I agree she may not be who she says she is, but if she wants to complete her mission objective with the least amount of scepticism from whomever finds her, why even bring the Des/Penny picture or mention the story about the 815 wreckage being found?  It just invites questions about her arrival.

I admit I know nothing about "special ops" protocol, but it seems to me that a simple story is best, not one with so many details.

Offline KateReallyLovesJack

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2007, 06:28:47 PM »
That's definately a smart way to think about it - the whole situation has been bothering me for a long time now, with the plane in the ocean, but a simple story does seem like it would be the way to go!

Offline Sweet Old Lady

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2007, 07:12:38 PM »
I think Naomi didn't expect to find survivors of a plane crash.  She was only looking for Desmond.  And when she said to Mikhail "I'm not alone" she may have thought he was Dharma, since he was wearing the Dharma jumpsuit.  Her rescue mission may have been triggered by the explosion of the Flame station by Locke and she is part of a Dharma team sent to reclaim the island from the "Hostiles".

Offline Chefpyro

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Re: "Well, obviously we're not dead"
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2007, 09:16:49 PM »
So what if the "calvary" happens to be the people that originally started the Dharma Initiative? Ben killed off all of the Dharma people with the toxic gas and let the hostiles run the show. Maybe they're coming to take back the island. Seems like they would know where the damn thing was though and not have to wait for Naomi to send them the location by phone.
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