Author Topic: Central Theme  (Read 3461 times)

Offline LostGirlDeb

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2007, 05:28:07 PM »
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i don't think desmond was trying to save himself or the losties, i think his whole agenda was seeing penny. 
I disagree, a big deal was made about 'rescue'.  Des's description to the group was 'someone is coming'.  While his agenda may have been seeing Penny, getting rescued was part of the package.

And Jin uttered his English word for the day "RESCUE"

Offline Ladybug

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2007, 05:47:34 PM »
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i don't think desmond was trying to save himself or the losties, i think his whole agenda was seeing penny. 
I disagree, a big deal was made about 'rescue'.  Des's description to the group was 'someone is coming'.  While his agenda may have been seeing Penny, getting rescued was part of the package.
he HAD to tell them it was about rescue, otherwise why would anyone help him find his long lost girlfriend?  i'm just saying desmond's REAL motive wasn't rescue, it was to find penny.

Offline LostGirlDeb

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #17 on: April 19, 2007, 05:51:58 PM »
Quote
i don't think desmond was trying to save himself or the losties, i think his whole agenda was seeing penny. 
I disagree, a big deal was made about 'rescue'.  Des's description to the group was 'someone is coming'.  While his agenda may have been seeing Penny, getting rescued was part of the package.
he HAD to tell them it was about rescue, otherwise why would anyone help him find his long lost girlfriend?  i'm just saying desmond's REAL motive wasn't rescue, it was to find penny.
Yeah I agree with LB on this one
Penny was his motivation and reason for everything in this epi

Offline Geronimo Jackson

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #18 on: April 19, 2007, 05:57:58 PM »
Quote
i don't think desmond was trying to save himself or the losties, i think his whole agenda was seeing penny. 
I disagree, a big deal was made about 'rescue'.  Des's description to the group was 'someone is coming'.  While his agenda may have been seeing Penny, getting rescued was part of the package.
he HAD to tell them it was about rescue, otherwise why would anyone help him find his long lost girlfriend?  i'm just saying desmond's REAL motive wasn't rescue, it was to find penny.
Yeah I agree with LB on this one
Penny was his motivation and reason for everything in this epi


I agree toowith LB but the central theme of sacrifice,redemption still stands and the new mythology of alternate time lines now in full play.

Offline Foxyschic

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #19 on: April 19, 2007, 06:14:10 PM »
I think it is interesting how the writers give us clues to current events from the flashbacks.  Desmond felt that he was supposed to "sacrifice" his own life (a 6 year relationship, poverty, speech, etc.).  However, even though he (mostly) accomplished this, this was not the course of events that he was destined to take. And his actions negatively affect those around him (both the monks and his former fiance).

In current events, Des feels like his visions now require another sacrifice, only this time it is someone else's life that is required.  Thankfully, like Locke, he does not feel that this is asked of him by the island, he just accepts it as what is supposed to happen for the course of events to be completed.  Instead, the sacrifice isn't made, and (he believes) that his actions have negatively affected his life (Penny isn't the pilot). 

I agree with LadyBug that the motivation was seeing Penny.  I don't think anything else would have made him willing to make any kind of sacrifice, whether himself or Charlie, even the hope of getting rescued. 



Offline ChellyKins

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2007, 08:46:30 PM »
Just as Locke says...the island is demanding a sacrifice. And I believe it should be Charlie, but for some reason Desie has the ability to stop this by seeing visions. So the island will demand it from another person.


So yes, I agree with most here...sacrificing SOMETHING would be the theme. lol

Offline puff6962

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2007, 11:25:32 PM »
The classic lost formula is to make you dislike somebody and then kill them.  Also, they will kill off somebody that has other contractual obligations or is drinking too much in Hawaii.  So, if Charlie remains likeable, the little bugga may make it a while longer.

Offline Chefpyro

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2007, 11:56:28 PM »
I kinda thought this episode was "running away from your monsters" it only chases you if you run from it. (like a dog) Desmond is running away from Penny. He ran away from the first girl to be a monk. I get the feeling that she wants him but he doesn't completely feel the same. all of our losties are running from something. we all have skeletons in our closet. at least that's what stevie wonder said.<------Pyro[move]

Offline CurtYanko

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2007, 12:58:06 AM »
Wow! Thanks to every body who took the time to respond. My notes from within minutes of the show (jotted down while on Big-O's show right after the episode ends) were also about the no-win situation Des is in. Seeing bits of the future and then walking the fine line in order to allow it to happen yet make a small well time change to prevent Charlie's death. I think what I actually articulated in the podcast was what Muse said, the balance between fatalism & free will and the 'value of sacrifice' (at the time thinking they were two separate candidates for my central theme. By the time I started this thread I realized they were intertwined but felt that 'sacrifice' was the predominant feature.

So certainly Muse you dead on with my thinking (too many of my podcast perhaps ;-).

Ladybug - I'm don't think Des was willing to sacrifice Charlie as evidenced by his getting the first aid kit (in the flash back he 'couldn't do anything' and this gave him some ammo) but even more so by his obvious tension the whole way. Still, it's been been said that when you get right down to it everyones motivation is based in self interest so perhaps you're on to something.

T Mack - your point about 'interpretation' crossed my mind as well. I even posed the question to Big-O if he thought it would have been Penny had he not saved Charlie? My $.02 is no because while he thought it was Penny coming, and in essence it was, it just wasn't her per se. Penny pays people to jump out of helicopters. I don't think he really thought it would be her but in the end allowed himself to hope it was (nod to LG). Your point about "In reality the Catch-22 was saving Charlie vs. saving himself/the Losties" is how I saw it too.

Foxyschic - I too the story telling aspect of the parallel story lines. Often times I am confused about our main story (or the flashback) until I make the connect to the flaschback (or the...)

...couple other random notes from this thread. I'm not sold that he is 'running from' Penny (though he is a self-confessed coward). I always to earnestly his pursuit of winning her fathers respect.

Prior to this episode I did not see Des as one of 'the' characters. I figured it was Locke and someone else but never sure who. Jack always seemed an obvious choice (science v faith) but Des is now a strong candidate in my mind with his fighting fatalism as opposed to Locke's accepting fate. I have the audio clip of him and Locke when they didn't enter the numbers which i may now have to put in the show as a regular ending piece or something. "You just killed us all", "No, I just saved us all". The early indications are that Locke was correct but... maybe, just maybe it progressed them further down the path of events that leads to their destruction. Maybe next time it will be Des who disrupts Locke's plans!


Thanks again. Dan and I are in the weeds but intend to record last weeks show tomorrow afternoon and then this weeks show tomorrow night to get caught up. If you have any interest in joining in on tomorrows night TalkShoe production check my site for the actual schedule and join in.

Offline AstroJones

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Re: Central Theme
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2007, 10:36:03 AM »
I'll also just make a note here to everyone, in case you weren't aware, Curt does the Black Rock Podcast which will be linked to from SWLS as part of the merger with Black Rock.  Sledge and I are hoping that sometime this weekend we can get some links set up to Curt's podcasts so that anyone interested in them can easily stay up-to-date when new ones are released.

But in the meantime, please CLICK HERE to check out any of the Black Rock podcasts.