Author Topic: Richard Lives!  (Read 5121 times)

Offline CaseyMac

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2010, 02:48:27 PM »
Partly why I think Richard was dead, is that it created a hell of alot of suspense in that scene. While I was watching it, I'm thinking, "If they killed Richard like that, is Ben a goner now too?" Ben sitting down on the porch (as boring as that sounds) was one of the biggest edge of my seat moments in Lost ever! Even when MIB sat down next to him, I was just waiting for him to plunge that knife in his chest. Excellent suspense!

Also, didn't MIB tell Richard that he wouldn't give him another chance to join him? Richard denied, and he's been hiding from him ever since.

Offline lostlady

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2010, 02:50:17 PM »

Also, didn't MIB tell Richard that he wouldn't give him another chance to join him? Richard denied, and he's been hiding from him ever since.

Very true! Richard had his chance....

Offline Madam P

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2010, 04:22:39 PM »
It is how Illana went out.

Not quite, Illana and Sayid exploded and Richard was pushed off screen. Tina Fey had her throat cut, Widmore was shot like 4 times. If it not shown on screen or there is no body, then there is no death.

I used that same argument for why I thought Lapidus was still alive, and I got laughed off the stage.

I think Richard is dead.  (I know, I know... same as Lapidus and I think Lapidus is alive, but... I think Lapidus might still have a purpose *fly the plane* and I can't think of one for Richard.)  As soon as Richard said "I'm going to go out there and talk to him -- he wants me to join him" I said to hubby "Uh, oh.  Richard is toast."

Offline Suzanne4au2

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #18 on: May 20, 2010, 04:40:25 PM »
oh my goodness I thought if anyone had my back on this one it was you Madam P!!! Richard can't be dead!!!

Offline Madam P

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #19 on: May 20, 2010, 04:42:24 PM »
LOL -- sorry, Suzanne!  But really, what else can Richard do?  He told us he doesn't know anything about the "island mysteries." 

Offline razzle-dazzle

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2010, 04:45:37 PM »
But Jacob made Richard to never die. I can't see how that can happen unless Jacob's powers are active only as long as he was alive.

Offline CaseyMac

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #21 on: May 20, 2010, 04:49:03 PM »
But Jacob made Richard to never die. I can't see how that can happen unless Jacob's powers are active only as long as he was alive.


Well, perhaps Richard wouldn't die of old age or disease, but he could be killed from a bullet, dynomite explosion, or being thrown across the island by a column of smoke that goes ticka ticka when it's mad.

If you are right, and Richard can't die under any circumstances, then we might see him walking around with his neck all twisted up like Meryl Streep in 'Death Becomes Her'.

Offline Madam P

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #22 on: May 20, 2010, 04:49:24 PM »
But Jacob made Richard to never die. I can't see how that can happen unless Jacob's powers are active only as long as he was alive.

That.


Offline WhatThe

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #23 on: May 20, 2010, 05:14:24 PM »
I think he's dead.  I think that's just where they are at this point...killing everyone off that they don't need.  I just can't believe they did that to Richard.  He was one of my favorites and I really wanted him to live to the end.

LOL -- sorry, Suzanne!  But really, what else can Richard do?  He told us he doesn't know anything about the "island mysteries." 

Yep, Richard is dead. There's only one episode left and we're STILL debating who is "really" dead and who isn't lol. Richard's dead. Widmore's dead. Lapidus is dead. If nothing else, this season is showing that the writers aren't too concerned about giving completed story arcs and heroic "save the day" endings to the audience's most beloved characters. They just kill them off and move on.

And as was stated above, Richard--when all is said and done--was really a nobody in the grand scheme of things. He didn't know exactly why all of the stuff was occurring and seemed pissed the eff OFF that Jacob died before he could be filled in...when he heard Ilana say that Jacob told her to follow Richard because he would know what to do, Richard just gave an incredulous laugh, like saying "You've gotta be kidding...I don't know squat." And Richard's plan that he came up with was--ta daaa--to blow up the plane. That's a plan anybody could have come up with (in fact Widmore DID come up with it as well lol). The icing on the cake was having Richard killed off quickly and unceremoniously, as if he were little more than an extra with a few lines of dialog. The Mysterious and enigmatic Richard ended up being just another guy and held little importance in the grand scheme of things.

Offline lostlady

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #24 on: May 20, 2010, 05:16:52 PM »
I think he's dead.  I think that's just where they are at this point...killing everyone off that they don't need.  I just can't believe they did that to Richard.  He was one of my favorites and I really wanted him to live to the end.

LOL -- sorry, Suzanne!  But really, what else can Richard do?  He told us he doesn't know anything about the "island mysteries." 

Yep, Richard is dead. . The Mysterious and enigmatic Richard ended up being just another guy and held little importance in the grand scheme of things.

So true. *cries a little*

Offline CaseyMac

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2010, 05:32:22 PM »
I think he's dead.  I think that's just where they are at this point...killing everyone off that they don't need.  I just can't believe they did that to Richard.  He was one of my favorites and I really wanted him to live to the end.

LOL -- sorry, Suzanne!  But really, what else can Richard do?  He told us he doesn't know anything about the "island mysteries." 

Yep, Richard is dead. . The Mysterious and enigmatic Richard ended up being just another guy and held little importance in the grand scheme of things.

So true. *cries a little*

I don't know about that. Richard played a pretty vital role in alot of the major events on the Island. I mean just because he didn't have all the answers doesn't mean he was "just another guy".

Also, the fact that Richard, and some of the other main characters are dying off in the way they are I think actually creates a tremendous amount of suspense. Alot of times in movies, even though a main character might be in dire peril, deep down we know they will be ok. I mean when you watch Superman, do you ever honestly think Superman is going to die? No. So while there is some suspense, it always reaches a glass ceiling.

Now in Lost...they've made it clear that nobody is safe, which adds an infinite amount of suspense. I mean how many of you were on the edge of your seat when Flocke and Ben were sitting on the porch after Richard got tossed? I have a feeling this finale is going to be one of the most intense television experiences I've had...not to hype it up too much.

Offline WhatThe

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2010, 06:17:07 PM »
I don't know about that. Richard played a pretty vital role in alot of the major events on the Island. I mean just because he didn't have all the answers doesn't mean he was "just another guy".
Other than taking Ben into the temple as a child, I can't really think of any "major events" that Richard play a role in. He was around during some major events but he didn't really play a vital role. I suppose you could say that helping Kate and Sayid survive Keamy's team was a major event...but you'd like to think that Richard's duties were more important than simply being a hired gun lol.


Quote
Also, the fact that Richard, and some of the other main characters are dying off in the way they are I think actually creates a tremendous amount of suspense. Alot of times in movies, even though a main character might be in dire peril, deep down we know they will be ok. I mean when you watch Superman, do you ever honestly think Superman is going to die? No. So while there is some suspense, it always reaches a glass ceiling.

Now in Lost...they've made it clear that nobody is safe, which adds an infinite amount of suspense. I mean how many of you were on the edge of your seat when Flocke and Ben were sitting on the porch after Richard got tossed? I have a feeling this finale is going to be one of the most intense television experiences I've had...not to hype it up too much.

The problem I had with Richard's death wasn't so much the manner in which it happened, but instead that nothing of real substance occurred before it happened. In the Richard-centric episide Richard finally accepts that he needs to do what his dead wife told him he needed to do (via Hurley), and that's keep MiB from leaving the island. They made it seem as if his finally coming around and finally taking the lead in stopping Smokie was a significant and important event. Alright, Richard!

But as we now see, it wasn't significant and important, and neither was he...he really was just "another guy" who came up with a rather easy and generic plan of action, again one that any of the survivors could have just as easily come up with themselves. It didn't require Richard's experience and enlightenment as Jacob's right-hand man for 150 years...Arnzt would have come up with the same freakin' plan lol. I wish I had felt as if some very real solution died right along with Richard...that his death meant that whatever they needed to do they can now no longer do...that Richard's extremely unique experience and role with Jacob was providing the survivors--and the show--with some MUCH needed knowledge as to how to stop MiB. At least that way his death would not only be sudden, but would make me feel as if the Losties are in even deeper sh!t than they were before. But I felt none of that. Richard's death didn't really effect anything.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2010, 06:19:19 PM by WhatThe »

Offline CaseyMac

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2010, 10:26:23 PM »
I wish I had felt as if some very real solution died right along with Richard...that his death meant that whatever they needed to do they can now no longer do...that Richard's extremely unique experience and role with Jacob was providing the survivors--and the show--with some MUCH needed knowledge as to how to stop MiB. At least that way his death would not only be sudden, but would make me feel as if the Losties are in even deeper sh!t than they were before. But I felt none of that. Richard's death didn't really effect anything.

I see what you mean. The best stories are always the ones where the writer get his characters into the worst possible situation, and then gets them out of it. What you are talking about is similar to what I loved about the old A-Team. (I mean that in a good way) Basically in each A-Team, they would form a plan, then something would mess up the plan and there would be that "oh sh!t" moment. Then they would improvise some solution and win the day.

However, it's a little different in Lost here, and for me it's working. If Richard had a plan, then we the audience would know that there is a way to beat MIB and this is how, yada yada. However, even going into the finale, we have no idea how to beat this guy, only that our Losties need to figure out a way to do it. That creates a hell of alot of tension. At some point in this episode, likely when it looks like all hope is lost, somebody is going to say something to the effect of "I have an idea" and we won't know what it is, but that moment, when/if it happens, will be supercool, because we will finally see somebody with a real plan of killing MIB and winning the day.

Offline WhatThe

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #28 on: May 21, 2010, 12:23:53 AM »
I wish I had felt as if some very real solution died right along with Richard...that his death meant that whatever they needed to do they can now no longer do...that Richard's extremely unique experience and role with Jacob was providing the survivors--and the show--with some MUCH needed knowledge as to how to stop MiB. At least that way his death would not only be sudden, but would make me feel as if the Losties are in even deeper sh!t than they were before. But I felt none of that. Richard's death didn't really effect anything.

I see what you mean. The best stories are always the ones where the writer get his characters into the worst possible situation, and then gets them out of it. What you are talking about is similar to what I loved about the old A-Team. (I mean that in a good way) Basically in each A-Team, they would form a plan, then something would mess up the plan and there would be that "oh sh!t" moment. Then they would improvise some solution and win the day.

However, it's a little different in Lost here, and for me it's working. If Richard had a plan, then we the audience would know that there is a way to beat MIB and this is how, yada yada. However, even going into the finale, we have no idea how to beat this guy, only that our Losties need to figure out a way to do it.

I think they still could have had that, though, even with Richard coming up with a much better plan than "We gotta blow up the plane". Lost could have treated it like it treats everything else, and only give vague clues to what Richard's plan consists of...

Richard: "We'll need a rope, some C4 explosives, some duct tape and a CD player. That's the only way to stop MiB from leaving the island."

Hurley: "Dude...why?"

Richard: "You wouldn't understand it even if I tried to explain it to you..."

Hurley: "Dude."

Then, later, Richard gets killed right as they're getting the CD player that Hurley brought with him and was always listening to during Season 1. The Losties--and the audience--still don't know what Richard's plan was, but both the characters and us the viewers spend countless hours and create dozens of threads trying to determine what those 4 items have to do with conquering the evil that is Smokie.


Quote
That creates a hell of alot of tension. At some point in this episode, likely when it looks like all hope is lost, somebody is going to say something to the effect of "I have an idea" and we won't know what it is, but that moment, when/if it happens, will be supercool, because we will finally see somebody with a real plan of killing MIB and winning the day.

My fear is that the "plan" someone comes up with is going to be incredibly basic--like Kate throwing dynamite down the hole when Smokie was dragging Locke down into it--and I'll find myself thinking "Wait...so all it took to defeat Smokie was THAT?" lol.

Offline Madam P

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Re: Richard Lives!
« Reply #29 on: May 21, 2010, 10:34:49 AM »
Richard's death didn't really effect anything.

Richard ended up basically serving the purpose of a red-shirt (like Widmore and even Jin/Sun/Sayid.)  As they say in "Galaxy Quest" -- they had to die to prove the situation is serious. 

I wish I had felt as if some very real solution died right along with Richard...that his death meant that whatever they needed to do they can now no longer do...that Richard's extremely unique experience and role with Jacob was providing the survivors--and the show--with some MUCH needed knowledge as to how to stop MiB. At least that way his death would not only be sudden, but would make me feel as if the Losties are in even deeper sh!t than they were before. But I felt none of that. Richard's death didn't really effect anything.

I see what you mean. The best stories are always the ones where the writer get his characters into the worst possible situation, and then gets them out of it. What you are talking about is similar to what I loved about the old A-Team. (I mean that in a good way) Basically in each A-Team, they would form a plan, then something would mess up the plan and there would be that "oh sh!t" moment. Then they would improvise some solution and win the day.

However, it's a little different in Lost here, and for me it's working. If Richard had a plan, then we the audience would know that there is a way to beat MIB and this is how, yada yada. However, even going into the finale, we have no idea how to beat this guy, only that our Losties need to figure out a way to do it.

I think they still could have had that, though, even with Richard coming up with a much better plan than "We gotta blow up the plane". Lost could have treated it like it treats everything else, and only give vague clues to what Richard's plan consists of...

Richard: "We'll need a rope, some C4 explosives, some duct tape and a CD player. That's the only way to stop MiB from leaving the island."

Hurley: "Dude...why?"

Richard: "You wouldn't understand it even if I tried to explain it to you..."

Hurley: "Dude."

Then, later, Richard gets killed right as they're getting the CD player that Hurley brought with him and was always listening to during Season 1. The Losties--and the audience--still don't know what Richard's plan was, but both the characters and us the viewers spend countless hours and create dozens of threads trying to determine what those 4 items have to do with conquering the evil that is Smokie.


Quote
That creates a hell of alot of tension. At some point in this episode, likely when it looks like all hope is lost, somebody is going to say something to the effect of "I have an idea" and we won't know what it is, but that moment, when/if it happens, will be supercool, because we will finally see somebody with a real plan of killing MIB and winning the day.

My fear is that the "plan" someone comes up with is going to be incredibly basic--like Kate throwing dynamite down the hole when Smokie was dragging Locke down into it--and I'll find myself thinking "Wait...so all it took to defeat Smokie was THAT?" lol.


Great post.  LOL.