Death count tonight

[BobBX542]

Yeah The otehrs that escaped the sub had Oxygen helpers for their trek from the depths. Frank would have had a LONG time of holding his breath.

Which would have been tricky seeing as how he was knocked out cold.

[I_Am_Jacob]

Yeah The otehrs that escaped the sub had Oxygen helpers for their trek from the depths. Frank would have had a LONG time of holding his breath.

Which would have been tricky seeing as how he was knocked out cold.

Just a bit.

[Madam P]

Always with the negative vibes, Moriarty...

[BobBX542]

Always with the negative vibes, Moriarty...

Madam, I try not to jump into these "arguements" (anymore), but look at the evidence. Frank was standing in the hall way, a mere few feet away from the (what I am presuming to be) solid steel door that was blown off it's hinges from the water pressure behind it (which equates to somewhere around a metric BUTT TON OF ENERGY), and hit him in the head. That alone would be enough to kill him, but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and saying it simply knocked him out. Now that he is knocked out though, the sub is flooding, and he will drown. I'm not being negative, just realistic, or about as realistic as I can be considering this is a fictional TV show.

[I_Am_Jacob]

Always with the negative vibes, Moriarty...

Madam, I try not to jump into these "arguements" (anymore), but look at the evidence. Frank was standing in the hall way, a mere few feet away from the (what I am presuming to be) solid steel door that was blown off it's hinges from the water pressure behind it (which equates to somewhere around a metric BUTT TON OF ENERGY), and hit him in the head. That alone would be enough to kill him, but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and saying it simply knocked him out. Now that he is knocked out though, the sub is flooding, and he will drown. I'm not being negative, just realistic, or about as realistic as I can be considering this is a fictional TV show.

Fear the "Metric Butt Ton" of force. Brutal. HAHA

[Madam P]

Always with the negative vibes, Moriarty...

Madam, I try not to jump into these "arguements" (anymore), but look at the evidence. Frank was standing in the hall way, a mere few feet away from the (what I am presuming to be) solid steel door that was blown off it's hinges from the water pressure behind it (which equates to somewhere around a metric BUTT TON OF ENERGY), and hit him in the head. That alone would be enough to kill him, but I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt and saying it simply knocked him out. Now that he is knocked out though, the sub is flooding, and he will drown. I'm not being negative, just realistic, or about as realistic as I can be considering this is a fictional TV show.

Fear the "Metric Butt Ton" of force. Brutal. HAHA

Oh, ye men of science.  Have a little faith!  LOL.  I just want Frank to have another role to fill yet, I guess.  Somebody's got to fly that plane...

[I_Am_Jacob]

NO one really has to fly the plane. If everyone in Island time is either slated to die or stay than no plane is needed. If in fact some people are slated to leave the Island than maybe John Locke will gain some semblance of consciousness from the SideLine^tm and fly the jet. Far fetched, but Kurt Russel did it in Executive Decision with Halle Berry as his stewardess copilot.

[Madam P]

I know nobody actually has to fly the plane.  But don't you think they have to THINK somebody's gonna fly the plane?  I mean, I can't imagine they're all going to pull a Jack and just say "I'm just going to stay here and die on the Island, because that's what I'm supposed to do."  I'm thinking at least SOME of whomever is left is going to be heading for that plane, and they surely must have some thought in mind as to who will be flying it once they get there, or they wouldn't head there in the first place.   So for purposes of the story or how it might end -- no, we might not necessarily need a plane.  Everybody might die and thus Alt-Timeline will be born or something.  But THEY won't know that.

Or, maybe Lapidus dying is the writers' way of writing-off the plane as an exit option.  Like Hurley will say "Well, guess we can't use the plane, dudes, 'cause Frank is, like, all dead and stuff." 


Are there any other ways left to get off the island?  (Other than the donkey-wheel room, maybe?)  Where is the yacht, The Elizabeth? 

[BobBX542]

I still don't understand how anyone is even thinking that the plane will even BE ABLE to get off the island. I was a doubter when it came to Frank landing the beast, but I was sadly mistaken, and I have come to terms with that. The truth of the matter though is that when it comes to landing a plane, all you really need is a place to put it down. Taking off is a much tougher process. Right now that plane is butted up against a mess of trees, so it is going to have to turn around to be able to even start moving forward, and that runway is no where near long enough to get a plane that size up to speed. I'm sorry, but taking off in that plane has always been a pipe dream.

[Madam P]

You're right -- it is pretty ridiculous. 

About as ridiculous as "Hey, let's dip this mostly-dead guy in that water over there and see if he wakes up."  Or "Let's sprinkle some of this ash around us so that black smoke thingy can't smash our brains out."  Or "Let me stand on the deck of this freighter that's about to blow into a million smithereens and toss me out in the middle of the ocean -- I'll probably make it OK."  Or "Let me hammer on the end of this nuclear device with a rock so that we'll all get to travel to a different time zone."  Or "Let me just push this donkey-wheel all the way around, and then this entire island will *blip* down into the ocean like a diving porpoise." 

   Just jerkin' your chain, you logical scientist, you. 

[BobBX542]

You're right -- it is pretty ridiculous. 

About as ridiculous as "Hey, let's dip this mostly-dead guy in that water over there and see if he wakes up."  Or "Let's sprinkle some of this ash around us so that black smoke thingy can't smash our brains out."  Or "Let me stand on the deck of this freighter that's about to blow into a million smithereens and toss me out in the middle of the ocean -- I'll probably make it OK."  Or "Let me hammer on the end of this nuclear device with a rock so that we'll all get to travel to a different time zone."  Or "Let me just push this donkey-wheel all the way around, and then this entire island will *blip* down into the ocean like a diving porpoise." 

   Just jerkin' your chain, you logical scientist, you. 

Yes, okay, you're right, but just because I've accepted all that doesn't mean I have to accept this. LOL I mean if you really want me to bend my imagination that far, then why don't they just flap their arms really hard and fly off??

[CaseyMac]

I have a problem calling any of the characters "pointless" or "useless". It's like in baseball, if the ball isn't hit into left field, does that mean the left fielder is useless? No. Sometimes characters are just there to support other characters. Not everyone can be the protagonist.

Yes, that is exactly what it means. His skill and talent were not used, so therefore, he was without use, or "Usless" as the kids say.

First, there is a difference between "unused" and "useless". I think you are getting into a very slippery slope in saying which characters have been pointless. Is Vincent pointless? Is Seth Norris pointless? Is Goodwin pointless? Is Eko pointless? I think it's awfully hard to draw a definitive line, so I choose not to draw a line at all. If you were in the show, you had a role, no matter how minor. It's like saying a particular brush stroke in Da Vinci's Starry Night is pointless. Each brush stroke is a part of the masterpiece.

Second, I actually totally agree with you that Frank is not only merely dead, but really most sincerely dead. There is no way he is going to pull a Mikhail and pop out of nowhere to save the day. However, it is curious then that they would have the plane land safely last season, and then not use it this whole time.

[Madam P]

 ...why don't they just flap their arms really hard and fly off??

ROFL!  I am fully expecting that next.   

No, wait!  We forgot the Hurley-bird!     It'll be like Luna Lovegood -- "How will we get there?  Why, we'll fly of course!" 

However, it is curious then that they would have the plane land safely last season, and then not use it this whole time.

A most excellent point.

[Holland34]

I have a problem calling any of the characters "pointless" or "useless". It's like in baseball, if the ball isn't hit into left field, does that mean the left fielder is useless? No. Sometimes characters are just there to support other characters. Not everyone can be the protagonist.

Yes, that is exactly what it means. His skill and talent were not used, so therefore, he was without use, or "Usless" as the kids say.

First, there is a difference between "unused" and "useless". I think you are getting into a very slippery slope in saying which characters have been pointless. Is Vincent pointless? Is Seth Norris pointless? Is Goodwin pointless? Is Eko pointless? I think it's awfully hard to draw a definitive line, so I choose not to draw a line at all. If you were in the show, you had a role, no matter how minor. It's like saying a particular brush stroke in Da Vinci's Starry Night is pointless. Each brush stroke is a part of the masterpiece.

Second, I actually totally agree with you that Frank is not only merely dead, but really most sincerely dead. There is no way he is going to pull a Mikhail and pop out of nowhere to save the day. However, it is curious then that they would have the plane land safely last season, and then not use it this whole time.

Are you trying to say that he's not just mostly dead?  Because if he's only mostly dead, Miracle Max is our man to bring him back.

[Madam P]

I have a problem calling any of the characters "pointless" or "useless". It's like in baseball, if the ball isn't hit into left field, does that mean the left fielder is useless? No. Sometimes characters are just there to support other characters. Not everyone can be the protagonist.

Yes, that is exactly what it means. His skill and talent were not used, so therefore, he was without use, or "Usless" as the kids say.

First, there is a difference between "unused" and "useless". I think you are getting into a very slippery slope in saying which characters have been pointless. Is Vincent pointless? Is Seth Norris pointless? Is Goodwin pointless? Is Eko pointless? I think it's awfully hard to draw a definitive line, so I choose not to draw a line at all. If you were in the show, you had a role, no matter how minor. It's like saying a particular brush stroke in Da Vinci's Starry Night is pointless. Each brush stroke is a part of the masterpiece.

Second, I actually totally agree with you that Frank is not only merely dead, but really most sincerely dead. There is no way he is going to pull a Mikhail and pop out of nowhere to save the day. However, it is curious then that they would have the plane land safely last season, and then not use it this whole time.

Are you trying to say that he's not just mostly dead?  Because if he's only mostly dead, Miracle Max is our man to bring him back.

And there you have it.  Billy Crystal is going to be the big surprise mystery guest star, because the MIB is really Miracle Max.