Author Topic: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?  (Read 6703 times)

Offline TheBrightandTheDark

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2010, 11:03:39 AM »
I think it's obvious that Ben was saying stuff for effect, so that Jack would back down. He must have spoken with Tom beforehand and advised him not to kill them, even if he later asked him to.

I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion, but we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I just don't see it.
I always thought Tom was talking about how HE decided not to kill them. But now that I'm reading the transcripts, which I know are correct, it looks like Tom is saying, "We SHOULD HAVE killed them, instead of shooting the sand. Because we didn't kill them, even after they've killed seven of our guys, Ben has lost it." And Ryan is trying to ease Tom's anger by saying, "I know you think we should have killed them, but we had to follow Ben's orders to NOT kill them." ... I can't believe I didn't see this before.  :-[

Offline BobBX542

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2010, 11:11:33 AM »
Well, until I see the scene that shows Ben telling Tom to not shoot them, I don't buy it. Just seems like yet another unnecessary layer to add onto the whole thing.

Offline MangoBingo

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2010, 12:38:09 PM »
Well, until I see the scene that shows Ben telling Tom to not shoot them, I don't buy it. Just seems like yet another unnecessary layer to add onto the whole thing.

Why would you need to see it? Ben's counter-order to not really kill them is explained in Tom's dialogue, as exposition.

Offline BobBX542

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2010, 04:05:54 PM »
Well, until I see the scene that shows Ben telling Tom to not shoot them, I don't buy it. Just seems like yet another unnecessary layer to add onto the whole thing.

Why would you need to see it? Ben's counter-order to not really kill them is explained in Tom's dialogue, as exposition.

Call me dense or what have you, but I'm not seeing/hearing that. I heard Ben tell Tom to shoot them, and then the next thing I know is that Ryan and Tom are arguing about killing them. Like I said, we'll have to agree to disagree.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 05:01:03 PM by BobBX542 »

Offline hackgrid

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2010, 04:50:29 PM »
Ben used his secret dharma-island-others-gay powers to contact Tom and the other others to tell them to not kill them ;)

Offline LostinLock

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2010, 05:04:56 PM »
It is obvious why they can't kill them they are proteced not a big duh

Offline SQUIRT199

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2010, 11:03:58 AM »
I think it's obvious that Ben was saying stuff for effect, so that Jack would back down. He must have spoken with Tom beforehand and advised him not to kill them, even if he later asked him to.

I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion, but we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. I just don't see it.
I always thought Tom was talking about how HE decided not to kill them. But now that I'm reading the transcripts, which I know are correct, it looks like Tom is saying, "We SHOULD HAVE killed them, instead of shooting the sand. Because we didn't kill them, even after they've killed seven of our guys, Ben has lost it." And Ryan is trying to ease Tom's anger by saying, "I know you think we should have killed them, but we had to follow Ben's orders to NOT kill them." ... I can't believe I didn't see this before.  :-[

Is this seriously new to people?

Seemed pretty obvious that Tom was following orders not to kill despite them not showing a scene in which Ben tell's Tom not to. When the episode originally aired, Tom was freakin out about not being able to kill them, what else would make Tom say Ben didnt know what he was talkin about? Why else would he be upset for shooting a bullet in the sand when he could have actually shot them if he chose to. Why didnt he just shoot them?  Because Ben told them not to. Ben telling them to kill them was for an effect on Jack, to place doubt in jack's mind that leading the people to the tower was a good idea, "look what you've done Jack, let 3 of your innocent friends die".

They have shown very few scenes of our losties using the toilet, are we to assume they have held it all this time?

Until they do show a scene where one of them does a # 1 or 2, I will assume they have the biggest bladders in the world,  or, maybe they are emptying their bladders in another timeline??

Don't mean to be a smart ass but you have to make some assumptions in this show, that not killing scene is one of them, at least it seems clear to me that Tom did not want to let them live.




Offline TheBrightandTheDark

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2010, 11:07:58 AM »
The lines he said, wanting to kill them, went against what we've seen up to this point to be his gentler nature. He hates the sight of blood. He's a big softie. So when he said that, it didn't make sense to me... and my mind resolved it by telling me I didn't understand what he said. Simple mistake. You can't honestly say you've understood every line of every episode, so give us a break.

Offline BobBX542

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2010, 11:29:18 AM »
Is this seriously new to people?

Seemed pretty obvious that Tom was following orders not to kill despite them not showing a scene in which Ben tell's Tom not to. When the episode originally aired, Tom was freakin out about not being able to kill them, what else would make Tom say Ben didnt know what he was talkin about? Why else would he be upset for shooting a bullet in the sand when he could have actually shot them if he chose to. Why didnt he just shoot them?  Because Ben told them not to. Ben telling them to kill them was for an effect on Jack, to place doubt in jack's mind that leading the people to the tower was a good idea, "look what you've done Jack, let 3 of your innocent friends die".

They have shown very few scenes of our losties using the toilet, are we to assume they have held it all this time?

Until they do show a scene where one of them does a # 1 or 2, I will assume they have the biggest bladders in the world,  or, maybe they are emptying their bladders in another timeline??

Don't mean to be a smart ass but you have to make some assumptions in this show, that not killing scene is one of them, at least it seems clear to me that Tom did not want to let them live.

It's not that it's new, I just happened to question something that Mango mentioned, and it whipped itself into this big controversy. I mean I understand that they are not showing us every single thing that happens on this island, I know this. Using your example of the bathroom, no, they haven't shown us that, but does that mean they haven't?? No, of course not. But this is a pretty significant moment, and I think that they would have told us specifically if something fishy was going on, which is why...

The lines he said, wanting to kill them, went against what we've seen up to this point to be his gentler nature. He hates the sight of blood. He's a big softie. So when he said that, it didn't make sense to me... and my mind resolved it by telling me I didn't understand what he said. Simple mistake. You can't honestly say you've understood every line of every episode, so give us a break.

Mrs. A and I seem to be on the same page. There was even another moment in that episode where Ben tells Tom (or maybe Ryan, I'm not quite sure) to go to the beach and take all the women, and if any of them are "stupid enough to get in their way, kill them."

Basically, Some of us are thinking one thing, and others are thinking other things. I know I'm not going to change my opinion, and you're obviously not going to change you're opinion, so let's just move on. My bad, didn't mean to start all of this.

Offline SQUIRT199

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2010, 11:57:50 AM »
The lines he said, wanting to kill them, went against what we've seen up to this point to be his gentler nature. He hates the sight of blood. He's a big softie. So when he said that, it didn't make sense to me... and my mind resolved it by telling me I didn't understand what he said. Simple mistake. You can't honestly say you've understood every line of every episode, so give us a break.
Is this seriously new to people?

Seemed pretty obvious that Tom was following orders not to kill despite them not showing a scene in which Ben tell's Tom not to. When the episode originally aired, Tom was freakin out about not being able to kill them, what else would make Tom say Ben didnt know what he was talkin about? Why else would he be upset for shooting a bullet in the sand when he could have actually shot them if he chose to. Why didnt he just shoot them?  Because Ben told them not to. Ben telling them to kill them was for an effect on Jack, to place doubt in jack's mind that leading the people to the tower was a good idea, "look what you've done Jack, let 3 of your innocent friends die".

They have shown very few scenes of our losties using the toilet, are we to assume they have held it all this time?

Until they do show a scene where one of them does a # 1 or 2, I will assume they have the biggest bladders in the world,  or, maybe they are emptying their bladders in another timeline??

Don't mean to be a smart ass but you have to make some assumptions in this show, that not killing scene is one of them, at least it seems clear to me that Tom did not want to let them live.

It's not that it's new, I just happened to question something that Mango mentioned, and it whipped itself into this big controversy. I mean I understand that they are not showing us every single thing that happens on this island, I know this. Using your example of the bathroom, no, they haven't shown us that, but does that mean they haven't?? No, of course not. But this is a pretty significant moment, and I think that they would have told us specifically if something fishy was going on, which is why...

The lines he said, wanting to kill them, went against what we've seen up to this point to be his gentler nature. He hates the sight of blood. He's a big softie. So when he said that, it didn't make sense to me... and my mind resolved it by telling me I didn't understand what he said. Simple mistake. You can't honestly say you've understood every line of every episode, so give us a break.

Mrs. A and I seem to be on the same page. There was even another moment in that episode where Ben tells Tom (or maybe Ryan, I'm not quite sure) to go to the beach and take all the women, and if any of them are "stupid enough to get in their way, kill them."

Basically, Some of us are thinking one thing, and others are thinking other things. I know I'm not going to change my opinion, and you're obviously not going to change you're opinion, so let's just move on. My bad, didn't mean to start all of this.

Apologies if that came off harsh, I forgot about the sight of blood, big softie angle.  For the record I dont think anyone here (other than myself) is stupid, I just like to argue I guess.

One thinks one thing and another thinks another is a fundamental basis of these boards, if we all agreed it wouldnt be much of a show I think.

I was trying to think of other examples specific to lost, but that was the best one I could come up with.
I do not see them going back and showing a scene where Ben tells them not to kill them no matter how much it sounds like he wants them to, so I guess we will have to agree to disagree but I cant see any other way to consider that radio conversation but to assume they had chatted beforehand.

Offline BobBX542

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2010, 12:07:57 PM »
Apologies if that came off harsh, I forgot about the sight of blood, big softie angle.  For the record I dont think anyone here (other than myself) is stupid, I just like to argue I guess.

One thinks one thing and another thinks another is a fundamental basis of these boards, if we all agreed it wouldnt be much of a show I think.

I was trying to think of other examples specific to lost, but that was the best one I could come up with.
I do not see them going back and showing a scene where Ben tells them not to kill them no matter how much it sounds like he wants them to, so I guess we will have to agree to disagree but I cant see any other way to consider that radio conversation but to assume they had chatted beforehand.

No apologies neccesarry. There is nothing anyone online can say to piss me off like that. LOL. But yeah, It is nice to have the people on here agree with you, but I know that's not always going to happen. Oh well.

Offline RM

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #26 on: February 17, 2010, 11:22:37 AM »
I think in "The Substitute", we have ?young Jacob? reminding UnLocke that he can't kill ?Sawyer? because those are The Rules; and the strong suggestion is that everyone whose name is written on the cave ceiling corresponds to people that Jacob touched and therefore are special pieces in their game and aren't supposed to be killed.  Sayid and Jin were on the beach with Tom and Brian and Sayid (and maybe Jin)'s names were on Jacob's ceiling.

Offline MangoBingo

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #27 on: February 17, 2010, 03:46:22 PM »
I think in "The Substitute", we have ?young Jacob? reminding UnLocke that he can't kill ?Sawyer? because those are The Rules; and the strong suggestion is that everyone whose name is written on the cave ceiling corresponds to people that Jacob touched and therefore are special pieces in their game and aren't supposed to be killed.

But Locke's name was uncrossed - until M.I.B. crossed it out.

Was it really Jacob's cave or M.I.B.'s? Jacob seemed quite at home within the statue of Tawaret.

Offline BobBX542

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2010, 06:32:14 PM »
Maybe the cave was like Jacob's "office".

Offline misseko815

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Re: Why Can't The Temple Others Kill Our Losties?
« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2010, 10:19:11 PM »
Maybe the cave was like Jacob's "office".
I thought I saw Dwight Schrute in the background!!!